Replies

1. 
   EarlKelly | Jul 24, 2006 03:20pm | #1

   I would suggest you hire these out. Without a vacuum press and a little experience, you're looking at a very difficult job minimum and a utter failure at worst. You would need to build a male/female form that can be clamped up to glue laminations and veneer. Contact will not holdup especially in any kind of damp enviroment, like a kitchen or bath.

   If you spec out the doors, you should be able to find someone near you with a vacuum press that would glue these up for you. If there's not too many they could be shipped fairly reasonable.

   Furniture...the Art of a FurnitureMaker
2. 
   jackplane | Jul 24, 2006 03:22pm | #2

   Two part resourcinol glue or epoxy are among the best for gluing up laminations. W/o a vacuum press, you can use a form instead. For the veneer, I'd use regular wood glue on both veneer and substrate- let sit apart and dry. Then (with a towel) iron together. Contact cement will not allow movement, which causes the veneer to crack over time.

    Also, 3 mm mdf- since you're curving this, it'll need to either wet or kerf bent to work effectively.

   
   

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   Edited 7/24/2006 8:34 am ET by jackplane

3. 
   RickL | Jul 24, 2006 05:11pm | #3

   Hammer Veneering would be a perfectly good option. It's not where you beat it with a hammer. You can make a simple hammer from wood and a piece of brass or UHMWfor the edge or there . Contact cement is not a good choice with unbacked veneer.

   http://www.sapfm.org/e_millard/hammer%20veneering%20crest%20rays.asp

   http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/ToolGuide/ToolGuidePDF.aspx?id=2931

   
   

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   Edited 7/24/2006 10:36 am ET by RickL

4. 
   sapwood | Jul 24, 2006 10:11pm | #4

   For the core use a rigid setting glue like Weldwood or Unibond 800. Epoxy is good but nasty and expensive. You want a glue that gives enough open time to enable spreading it all, assembly, then clamping. Use a caul over the last lamination to spread the pressure from the clamps. For clamps you can use whatever will cover the area and will bring the laminations into close contact. Perhaps band clamps will work....... I dunno without knowing the sizes, amount of curve, number of lams, etc. Experiment without glue.... see what happens. If the lams look to be tight then you're home free. Apply glue and go.

   Do the core first then the veneer. The doors may be convex or concave from the outside but that's relative. The forms look the same for either.

   For the veneer, you can use dry/iron-on pva or hide glue - hammered on. Don't use contact cement. If you have never veneered anything then some practice on a flat panel is advised. You really might want to consider getting a vac press. It makes the job a piece of cake. If you are into production kitchen cabs it will pay for itself very quickly.

1. 
   dgreen | Jul 24, 2006 10:47pm | #5

   I second the recommendation for the vacuum press, great results and really not that expensive considering the cost of good conventional clamps. You will be surprised at how many other uses you will find once you have vacuum in your shop, work hold downs, vacuum chucks for turning etc.
   Since the house is on fire let us warm ourselves. ~Italian Proverb

5. 
   KeithNewton | Jul 25, 2006 01:19am | #6

   John, you may own a vacuum pump without even knowing it. I'll bet you do own a compressor, if so, all you need to do is leave the tank open, and find the plumbing to hook a hose to the intake side.

   If things as small as cabinet doors, you can use a clear plastic drum liner for the bag. $10 over here will buy a box of 80 of them. You can cut the bottom corner off, and shove the hose through, then wrap something soft and sticky like rope caulk, however chewing gum would probably work.

   To seal the other end, you can run the top open end between two thin strips of wood, then roll it up about 3 turns, then put a few spring clamps on it to pinch it together.

   If you are interested, drop me an email, and I will give some more details, but I need to get back to work now. K

1. 
   dgreen | Jul 25, 2006 01:46am | #7

   Many compressors will not work in that manner because the valves will float as soon as you pull even a little vacuum. Another source for inexpensive bags is water beds, new or used they are cheaper than what are sold for "vacuum bags". Your rolling and clamping seal will work fine but instead of chewing gum you can buy vacuum putty or vacuum tape very reasonably. A couple layers of waterbed patch material and cement from a patch kit works very well for sealing around fittings.
   Since the house is on fire let us warm ourselves. ~Italian Proverb

6. 
   periodcraftsmen | Jul 25, 2006 05:29am | #8

   JRPOW

   THIS IS A REAL EASY PROCESS WITH MANY DIFFRENT OPTIONS FOR GLUES.  ALL YOU NEED IS SOME BENDING PLY WOOD AND SOME CLAMPS.  JUST HAMMER VENEER WITH EITHER HIDE GLUE, TITEBOND, FRANKLIN HIDE GLUE, GORILLA GLUE JUST ABOUT ANY GLUE.  JUST BE AWARE OF THE OPEN TIME.  IF THESE DOORS ARE BIG TRY FRANKLIN HIDE GLUE OR TITEBOND.  JUST BE AWARE OF GLUE BLEDDING THROUGH THE VENEER.  ALSO A LITTLE GLUE GOES A LONG WAY.  IF YOU NEED TO EXPLAIN PROCESS IN MORE DETAIL THAN POST YOU NEED MORE DETAIL INFO.

   FREDDY ROMAN

   18TH CENTURY FURNITURE MAKER

1. 
   jrpow | Jul 25, 2006 02:45pm | #9

   Thanks for your help.   this sounds like the way to go. We have titebond over hear in Australia if its the same thing (aliphatic resin glue)  just read the lable and its made in Columbus Ohio by Franklin International.) If its not to mutch trouble could you please explain your method for this way in more detail. Some people have suggested ironing on the veneer. I have used this method before with PVA with good results on single pieces but found veneer joints opened up under a hot iron. Also I dont see how you can use a (flat) iron to press veneer onto a concave surface. You could email me the details if you like. [email protected] although I think there will be other visitors to this forum who would be interested to read of your methods.

   Many thanks in advance.   John.

1. 
   creekwood | Jul 25, 2006 03:19pm | #11

   I recently used an iron on a concave surface, no problem. You use a damp rag anyway, and the iron will heat the rag as it follows the curve. This was using hide glue., and tilting the iron to make contact.

2. 
   jrpow | Jul 25, 2006 02:51pm | #10

   Sorry I forgot to say there are about 8 doors in all, the biggest is only 700mm high x about 650mm wide.

   Thanks again John.

1. 
   KeithNewton | Jul 25, 2006 04:08pm | #12

   John, let me make another try to steer you on the right path. After 30 years in this trade, it is time for you to add vacuum bagging to your bag of tricks. Why don't you spend a little time exploring this site. They also have a fourm.http://www.vacupress.com/vacuumveneering.htm