Hi All,
Just got my new end vise, a Veritas Twin Screw. Now I have a front vise and an end vise, but no back or begin vise?!?!?! 🙂 🙂
From reading the instructions, I understand you need to apply a 2° bevel across the front face. I’m sure I can do that on my planer as suggested in the instructions.
Are there any other caveats I should be aware of?
Thanks in advance,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Replies
Bob,
My bench, built over the last couple of months or so, has two of the Veritas twin screw vises. I have put the bevel on the inside face of the outside jaw of one but not the other.
But I also use some false-face inner jaws lined with 3mm leather, which partly obviates the need for the 2 degree slope, as the leather squishes to take up some of the slight top-to-bottom rack of the vise. I highly recommend the leather, whether you put it on false jaws or on the actual vise jaws.
The weight of the jaws seems to have some effect on the amount of top-to-bottom racking (heavy = more racking) but I suspect the racking will slowly increase as the screws bed and wear.
Thinking about the 2 degrees, it should only be necessary when you're gripping a shallow piece that does not "drop"past the screws. This would allow the vise to rack top-to-bottom a little, if it is so inclined. Therefore the workpiece would be gripped less at the top lip of the jaws than further down (which you do not want and why the 2 degrees is recommended).
However, if the workpiece in the jaws drops below the level of the screws, the racking effect should not occur (I think).
In all events, I recommend the inner jaws with leather on. Mine just hang loosely over the screws and close up on the workpiece when the vise is screwed in. To ensure there is no racking of the top-to-bottom kind, I have also stuck some veneer on the back of these jaws, at the top edge. This has the same effect as the 2 degree slope would have - the jaws close first at the top.
I will be making a few more of these inner jaws for shaped work, like chair parts, before too long.
Lataxe
The weight of the jaws seems to have some effect on the amount of top-to-bottom racking (heavy = more racking) but I suspect the racking will slowly increase as the screws bed and wear.
I'm not sure if I'm understanding this point; I'm in no way questioning your logic. The instructions show a shim (for lack of a better way of expressing it) installed above the screws, 1/16" away to prevent the jaws from sagging. I'm imediately thinking of making the shim of a material that won't wear on the screws to prevent jaw sagging when extended.
I must confess that installing the vise will be a new experience for me.
Am I over-thinking it?
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob, I have read the instructions for 14 months as I attempt to setup my new shop in East TN. Many other tasks, property, house, business and other big equipment get in the way. In mid March I make another trip from NY and first on the menu is the twin on the factory maple top. I already mortised in the Record 53 on the front and for the twin will use shimmed thick high density poly over the lead screws. I will probably cove them with a hollowing base on a #45, shimmed to just clear of the screws. As I learn the area it took me a year to find local resources and a good mill to get heavy stock for the faces. Now I am good to go and will get her done. If I see some dry 3 1/2" stock I will make the sled bases , it's presently on a Rockler heavy bench frame (metal) that will be used for bench top equipment once I can make the bases. Good luck with your effort. Paddy
Paddy,
I hear you loud and clear.
My objective with this thread is to gather the knowledge of fellow Knotheads in the hopes of providing a successful install of this vise for all.
Best Regards, Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Lataxe
Do you put leather on both jaw surfaces or just the false (I assume bench side) face? Thanks. Tom"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"
Tom,
Thread/post 33822.137 contains some pics of the leather-lined false jaws. The leather goes on only the inner faces of the false jaws, not on the real jaws at all.
Andy Rae posted the original advice about leather lining vise jaws, in thread 32919.
Lataxe
Thanks. Tom"Notice that at no time do my fingers leave my hand"
I have had a Veritas twin screw vise for quite a while (probably over 10 years now). I did not taper the front face because I was unsure of my ability to do it accurately. I have had no problems with the functionality of the vise. I suppose that the bottom portion of the face tends to come in contact with the item being held before the top portion but this does not seem to affect its ability to hold things firmly.
As a note of interest, I recently aquired a Veritas low angle smoothing plane and because it works so well for me I am thinking of finally tapering the rock maple front face of my vise.
Hi Al,
I may be way off base with my initial observations about this vise, but I'm beginning to suspect that the major reason for the 2° slant on the front vise jaw is to compensate for the potential sagging of the vise when it is extended/opened, over time.
I need to do more research, but I'm inclined to reinforce the support of the screws to prevent them from allowing the front vise face to sag. Replaceable UHMW shims perhaps?
Just my 2¢,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob,
In practice, the vice will 'pull up' onto what ever is in it, the only real issue between vices is how much deflection for any given tension and shape between the jaws. Heavy metal working vices have what is effectively a cast metal telescope that is up to 8" long. the inner 'tube' is cast as part of the moveable jaw and the outer cast as part of the fixed jaw. Very little rack or sag untill the metal wears in about 30 years.
The 2 degrees is often recommended as a means of ensuring that fairly small pieces can be engaged at the top of the jaws. With only that small amount of slope the jaws will pull up onto larger pieces to use all of the surface area for grip.
My 2c on the'shim' (appreciating that my grandmother never did such eggs well). if I anticipate wear or stress I try to design in my preferred point of failure. In Aust we typicaly tie horses up to a piece of baling twine attached to the fence or float. When a horse pulls back the twine breaks first and the horse still has a serviceable headstall and rope to be caught with. I would make the shim from something as simple as pine and expect it to be worn out by the metal screws over a couple of years. fix it with three screws andd treat replacement as routine maintenance.
Dave
PS am thinking on taking out a second mortgage on a new bench but have mt eyes on one of those tucker things, difficult to justify given my demonstrated output.
Ah, so something wearable and replaceable that would prevent tipping of the front jaw would be appropriate. I'm thinking of UHMW replaceable shims under the benchtop as a substitute for pine, as you suggested.
As for the eggs, we have a fine flock of Rhode Island Reds that provide us with a substantial quantity on a daily basis; the excess we sell.
The Equine suggestions, I will duly pass them on to the wife as she is the rider.
Cheers Mate,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob, from what I can tell the 2% compensates for 'up/down' racking as the vice tightens. I have never found that this affects hholding power.
I don't seem to have experienced any sag after many years.
Hi Bob,
A few things I can tell you about:
Read the directions through several times, and then, "Follow their directions to the "T"..." If you'll do that, you'll have an enjoyable time making your twin screw vise....and your wife will never have to know you did as you were told......(I've been there...LOL)
First, make the "depth jig" like they say!! It will tell you where to drill the intersecting holes the short threaded shafts go into that the backjaw's bolts screw into your workbench.
Second, you can use some 3/8" thick by 3" wide Teflon-like material sold by Rockler or Woodcraft. Screw it to the underside of your workbench with some short sheetmetal screws, and place it between the threads and the underside of your workbench. As you open your front vise jaw, and it begins to slightly drop down, and the back end of the threaded leadscrews tip upward, the super dense plastic will help keep the front jaw from dropping so far as the threads wear.
Third, when you tighten up the vise, as it tightens use both hands to place equal pressure/torque. It will take a lot of the pressure off the chain drive, and most important, it will keep you from shearing-0ff the brass pin use to allow you to skew your jaws if a board's edges aren't parallel.
I made my jaws from Hard Rock Maple and included walnut for a trim line to match the one I inlayed on the apron around the bench top. On the top edges, where you'll give it lots of wear-and-tear, I inset some ENDGRAIN of the matching woods into the jaw edges and hardened the strip with thin CA. I used Waterlox to finish all surfaces of the jaws; it's a really hard finish and gives the jaws some extra bite.
Good Luck with yours, Bill
Edited 2/8/2007 7:06 pm ET by BilljustBill
Edited 2/8/2007 7:21 pm ET by BilljustBill
Bill,
Your post, adds further weight to my hypothesis:
and it begins to slightly drop down, and the back end of the threaded leadscrews tip upward, the super dense plastic will help keep the front jaw from dropping so far as the threads wear.
Support the screws from behind and underneath the benchtop. This combined with a slight cant of the front vise face should keep things in order. In retrospect, the instructions do talk about this.
Thanks for the help,
P.S. Nice bench!Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled