Replies

1. 
   forestgirl | Mar 17, 2005 06:16pm | #1

   Wow, cool find!  3" thick?  Whoa.

   You can mill them with your equipment, but it's gonna take some time.  You can resaw on a table saw, but not 11" wide unfortunately.  You'd have to cut them down to about 7" or so, use a rip blade and make 1 pass from each edge of the board.  Use a good rip blade like the Diablo 24-tooth found at big box stores.

   You can use a table saw and router to joint edges.  Face jointing is more problematic.  With wood that size, handplaning might be the way to go, though you can face-joint on a planer with the use of a sled and wedges.

   Is there a cabinet shop in your area?  You might be able to pay them to size the lumber for you.  Where do you live (no info in your profile)?

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
   Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

   
   

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   Edited 3/17/2005 11:16 am ET by forestgirl

1. 
   lumberjacksson | Mar 17, 2005 06:47pm | #3

   Thanks for your reply, a couple things came to mind. 

   I envisioned pushing these things through the planer and getting dead straight parallel faces but the more I think about it the less I think that is going to happen. 

   I have a friend with an 8" jointer.  If I rip the boards the way you've explained (to 7") could I then surface them on the jointer or would I have to surface before taking them across the table saw?  (I think I know the answer and not sure I want to hear it... lol)

   Also, I think this would be a great opportunity to learn how to hand plane like you've suggested.  Since I'm minutes from a lee valley (and I know you are their #1 router table sales lady ;) could you recommend which of their planes would do the trick?  (smoother etc.)

   BTW I'm living in Calgary Alberta.

   Thanks again FG!

   Andy

1. 
   forestgirl | Mar 17, 2005 07:54pm | #5

   Keep in mind, I'm discussing this in theory -- have certainly never tackled a project like this (wouldn't mind the chance, though, LOL!).  Will proceed on the assumption that the wood not only has not been treated (in which case, pass right on by!), but also that there is no debris imbedded in the surface that would wreak havoc with jointer and planer blades.

   Alot would depend on how straight the lumber is when you start with it.  You've got to get one straight edge right from the get-go.  If you have one on the timber, it goes against the table saw fence for ripping.  Then, the edge that's produced by the ripping operation ("A") goes against the jointer fence as you face joint one side.  That gives you a flat face ("B") that is 90* to "A".  Then you can rip the other edge, opposite "A", call that "C".  Run the timber through the planer with face "B" on the table.  Voila! square timber.  Resaw using the table saw.  Take my 7" number as only a reference.  You'd want your maximum thickness to be somewhat less than twice the max height of the blade above the table.  (I'm assuming, in this long diatribe, that your friend also has a table saw!)

   If you don't have a straight edge on a raw timber, you'll need to make a carrier sled with a straight edge that goes against the fence.  Sort of a "prosthetic straight edge."

   If you can't use a saw in the same building as the jointer.....ech....that's a bit of a drag.  You could size the timber first on the tablesaw I guess, but you've gotta be sure you're not running seriously un-straight wood on the fence or the table.  Any instability in the timber as it goes through the blade is an invitation to disaster.  I was cutting 3/4" x 12" warped stock the other day, and event that was pretty nervewracking.

   As to planes, I've not graduated to using them yet!  Please, ask me about router tables, ROFL.  Seriously, though, I'd suggest starting a new thread and ask specifically about the plane advice.  You'll get some good advice here, I'm sure.

   Now, be a sweet guy and go update your profile :-)forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   Manchild | Mar 18, 2005 06:01am | #8

   What about using a carrier for the planer. Like the one in the current FWW?

2. 
   DennisS | Mar 17, 2005 06:47pm | #2

   AE -

   The term "lagging" refers in heavy excavation type construction to the big timbers used to shore up the sides of vertical earth walls during construction of the lower parts of big buildings. Of course, these timbers you found may or may not have been intended for that use, don't know. But the lagging used around here is sometimes made from treated wood. Could be that your timbers were milled but not yet treated. That's a good thing. But check to see if they appear to have been impregnated with any nasty preservative stuff.

   ...........
   From Beautiful Skagit Co. Wa.
   Dennis
1. 
   lumberjacksson | Mar 17, 2005 06:58pm | #4

   I beleive they were intended for construction use but they weren't treated.  IF they were would it be the green stuff or something like creosote?  What would I look for?

    

    

1. 
   DennisS | Mar 19, 2005 06:13am | #12

   AE -I can only speak to the practice(s) local here in the Pacific NW. The lagging we've used for temporary retention walls in deep building excavations was not treated with creosote. Now that I think about it, I may be mistaken - it may not have been treated at all. Most pressure treated timbers show "teeth" marks where penetrations are made in the surface of the wood to aid the permeation of the treating materials. There is a treatment that doesn't display this telltale sign but it's generally reserved for finish decking and outdoor wood in residential use. So I suspect if your timbers don't have these indentation marks all over perhaps they're not treated at all.That said, keep in mind that these timbers were milled for a specific and temporal purpose - retention of earth during construction of basement walls. This is not exactly cabinet wood!It's been some time ago that I worked on any hi-rise building projects and don't recall the specs for the lagging. Whether it was to be kiln dried or just used green - don't recall. Just be careful when you mill it and be on guard for lots of movement in the wood as it's ripped down into useable pieces. Again, I stress that I could be over reacting but I'd prefer to err on the side of caution than to see you get into a problem working with these big timbers. You can most likely get some useable lumber from them but I'd suspect there will be a rather high waste factor as well............
   From Beautiful Skagit Co. Wa.
   Dennis

3. 
   DavidxDoud | Mar 17, 2005 11:10pm | #6

   check around and see if there is a sawyer in your area with a 'portable' type mill - - if your material was 'virgin',  i.e. no metal,  no grit,  I'd do something like for $50 or so,  if you would bring them to the site on a day I had the saw set up - - and it would be a great deal for you if you don't have any equipment as robust as the material....

    

    

   "there's enough for everyone"
4. 
   adastra | Mar 18, 2005 05:47am | #7

   I'm new to this discussion group, and discussion groups in general so I hope I'm not being rude in asking why you want to mill this stuff immediately.

   Do you have your projects in the works? I would store it as long and as thick as you can. Gives you the most options down the road. Also might check the moisture content before you build with it.

   But if you are ready to go you could check with local shops and see if they might resaw it for you. Might be the best way to get to where you want. Building something.

   Good luck. But keep in mind if there is a surprise inside you might be buying someone a resaw blade and they are far from cheap if its an industrial machine.

   Might even check with local guild or schools to get time on their equipment.

5. 
   JohnWW | Mar 18, 2005 08:09am | #9

   Are you sure these are worth the trouble and for that matter how sure are you that they are pine? They are just as likely or even more likely to be Douglas fir or some other softwood.

   If these were cut for construction lumber it was probably because the wood was of low quality and there is nothing that you can do to change that. It is also quite likely that the wood hasn't been stored or dried properly and will have serious checking and internal stresses and damage.

   John W.

1. 
   lumberjacksson | Mar 18, 2005 05:40pm | #11

   "

    

   Are you sure these are worth the trouble and for that matter how sure are you that they are pine?"

   No and no.  I picked up the first load last night and noticed that most had been cut from smaller trees.  There are no quartersawn boards and most show the centre.  These are definately construction grade. 

   Pine, fir, spruce... probably not a difference for 2x4's but for furniture I'm guessing there is.  (I haven't built anything but a bench, a storage shelf, and some jigs, ts and router fence and crosscut sled so far.. all out of ply).

   I've decided to try ripping a couple in half, then resawing them on the table saw.  It would in theory give me four 1-1/2"x5.5" boards I could maybe use to build a deck.

   I've got to go back tonight for another truck load.  There ended up being 25 in all and I only paid $5.50 a board so even if it is a failed venture stock wise I will hopefully be able to get someone to take the 150lb monsters out of my yard and recoup my costs.

   Live and learn!

    

   Andy Esarte

    

6. 
   DougF | Mar 18, 2005 04:52pm | #10

   You can construct a sled to square-up shortened (6' - 8') lengths using your planer.  The wood, when placed on the sled is shimmed to hold the wood solidly in place so when it emerges the face is square.  from there the rest is easy.  A recent edition of one of the WW magazines had an article on building a sled but I honestly can't remember which one.  I do remember that the sled needs to be constructed as a torsion box to eliminate any flexing.  Assembled and loaded with your pine, this sucker will be heavy so sturdy, strategically-place roller stands are a must.

   Doug

7. 
   lumberjacksson | Mar 19, 2005 06:36am | #13

   Thanks for all the useful information and time spent replying.

   I've decided that my idea was amateur. Far too much effort, and too dangerous to try and mill this wood. It turns out it would make warped furniture and rotten decking.

   I probably would have learned the hard way, and spent much time and $$ trying to jam this junk through my table saw if not for the useful info in this post. Wrecked blades, broken equipment, and some cracked ribs later I'd quit woodworking and miss out on all the fun.

   I've spent the last few months browsing here and feel that I'd be nowhere near the "theoretical woodworker" (I know how to do everything in theory) that I am today without this forum.

   So here's to you guys and gals (FG), and to better luck putting your knowledge to practice on the next batch of bargain finder wood.

   Andy Esarte

   
   

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   Edited 3/18/2005 11:46 pm ET by AEsarte

1. 
   DennisS | Mar 19, 2005 09:07am | #14

   Andy -You may well be able to salvage some of this material none the less. Find some good sections and chain saw them out. Will make working with it a lot easier. Say 6' or even 4' sections would be a lot easier to handle.Yes, it may well warp like a banana, but mill everything well oversize, stack and sticker it somewhere out of the weather and direct sun and forget about it for a few months or even a year. Keep it off the ground to avoid attacting critters. There may be some decent material in there. The waste stuff, ....(?) there's always the fireplace as a last resort. At least it would find a use............
   From Beautiful Skagit Co. Wa.
   Dennis