Just recently bought this plane. Did I get lucky and find a good one? Are these rare? Should I clean it up or leave it alone? The only markings are on the depth adjustment knob which states:
“BAILEYS PATENT” AUG.31,1858,AUG 6, 1867″ and it does not have a lateral adjustment lever. It is the same size as my Bailey #3 but I cannot find a number anywhere on the plane.
Replies
Excellent find!!! It is a pre-lateral Bailey, I can't tell for sure but it looks like a no. 3. The horn of the tote looks like it was broken and sanded down and the japanning is a bit worn, but hey, it's a 120+ year old plane. Feel free to clean off the surface rust, but by all means, DO NOT USE A WIRE WHEEL. A true collector will want to choke you if you do. I own a type 3, and paid a pretty penny for it, but they ain't getting less rare, are they?
Regards,
Sean
You might put a photo of just the frog up--a side view. You may have the second type 3 Bailey that's shown up on this forum. They're pretty rare and valuable if original. I just can't tell from the photos you've supplied.
It looks like the screw that holds the knob and the one that holds the lever cap are replacements. The tote looks to have been modified or perhaps even user made. These would have to be corrected for it to have any real value and it is rather rusty. You can clean it up but be careful not to "over clean" it and ruin the patina.
Nice find, if only as a conversation piece in your shop.
Regards,
Mack
"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
Additional pics which should help.
It's a type three #3 with a later version blade and possibly a newer lever cap. Quite rare. Worth about $800.00 with the original parts. Bob at Kinderville Acres scored one a couple of years ago. You can ask him about his and compare notes.
mike
Edited 9/22/2008 9:09 am ET by mvflaim
$800.00 would be quite the stretch! Maybe with ALL original parts AND in pristine condition and under "just right conditions" (someone willing to pay)! His has a LONG way to go to meet those requirements!!
$350 is what my book calls out for a specimen with all original parts, no damage and "good +" condition. His has a ways to go to meet even these conditions.
It is fairly rare and appears to be undamaged. He may be able to find the correct parts to put it back to proper condition but it may be very time consuming and possibly quite expensive to do so.
Regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
I agree Mack. His plane would probably go for around $200-250 in the condition it's in. More of a parts plane right now until he finds the right missing pieces.
I thought I saw a type 3 number 3 Stanley go for around $800 on ebay about a year ago??? I'll have to do some research.
Mike
Woodman threw it on ebay. We'll see what he gets for it.....
Edited 9/24/2008 11:55 am ET by mvflaim
That will be definitive! Hope he gets a good price for it.
I used to buy tools on E-Bay but haven't for a couple years now even though I still look regularly. Bargains are not as available as they once were!
Regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
That's unfortunate. I think he'd have gotten quite a bit more through Clarence Blanchard, who's got a very long contact list of Stanley nuts that might pay well more than the plane is worth in its current condition for the chance to retore on.
I suspect his e-bay bid will largely be by "bottom feeding" tool dealers looking for something they can rob off of it to complete an "almost" plane,which will then fetch far more money at one of the big auctions.
I was thinking that myself. Either Clarence or Patrick Leach could find a suitor who would pay a premiuim. I also think woodman could sell the plane in parts and probably get more money. I bet the front knob alone would get $50.00.. I've seen early Stanley knobs go for unreal amounts especially if you were a collector with a rare early Stanley plane with an imperfect front knob.
I also noticed that he has someone form Italy who wants to bid. I won't ship to Italy anymore due to the slow delivery of the Italian postal service. A gentleman bought a Stanley no 7 from me back in early August and the plane still has not been delivered to him. It was sitting in Customs for a month before they attempted to make delivery. To this day he still doesn't have the plane. Worse yet, the winning bidder filed a dispute through PayPal and PayPal put my funds in escrow until the matter is resolved. I have to wait until Oct 7th before I know the verdict of the PayPal investigation. I communicated through PayPal that the tool is still in transit and a delivery attempt has been made but it's up to PayPal to make a decision and possibly give the gentlemen his money back. If that happens and the plane is finally delivered, I lose the plane and my money. Never the less, I'm hoping for the best but it's completely out of my hands.
Edited 9/25/2008 8:00 pm ET by mvflaim
I was mislead by your first pictures. The screw that holds the lever cap appears to be original. In the first shots it looked very new and shiny. The one that holds the knob still looks like that but it may just be light green. That would be okay as brass does turn green.
The tote is very suspect. I believe it is a user made tote. What makes me think that is the shape. There is also the fact that the screw that holds it is set in further than it should be. It is possible that the original tote was broken on top and just ground or sanded down. That would leave the original screw standing proud. The hole may have been "deepened" and the screw cut off to match. I still think that tote was made by some previous owner after the original one gave up the ghost. If I were you and interested enough, I'd compare the tote carefully to another tote from an older #3. The shape just looks "off" to me; it looks too rectangular. I could be wrong (it certainly wouldn't be the first time--LOL) but in any case, even if it's original, it's been broken and would need to be replaced if the tool were to achieve it's max value.
Is there any indication of a trademark on the top of the blade?
Regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
That is an ideal candidate for EvapoRust for the rust removal. I've used it to restore a couple of very rusted planes and it did a great job. soak the parts over night (I use a plastic food-storage tub, put a glass caster to hold the blade or whatever up, so the liquid touches all surfaces. Next day, stick you fingers in there, pull it out, rinse it off and buff with steel wool. Pretty!
I agree with Jamie. I have now done about a dozen planes in Evaporust. Do be sure to take all the wood off first, though, because Evapo is water-based. The solution will stop and remove all rust. Because it doesn't attack the metal, it is ok to leave the tool in the bath longer than necessary if you are short on time. I have left stuff for days or even weeks.When you bring the tool out, the bare metal will be grey in color. The paint will be unaffected unless water-based. The grey is a film of residual carbon left from when the solution pulled the iron out of the iron oxide. It leaves the carbon from the alloy. The less carbon, the lighter grey. I wash that off with dish soap and water and light use of a scouring pad.You need to get a rust preventer on the bare metal immediately, or you will have flash rust. As soon as the parts are dry, I just spray everything with Boeshield.j
http://www.hyperkitten.com/tools/stanley_bench_plane/dating/
I was going to post that link myself, you beat me to it!! Good job.
I was also looking for a link to something that had all of the iron trademark types and their dates. I have a paper copies of it but can't remember where I got it from! They say the brain is the first thing to go (I think they say that, I can't remember for sure)!
If you have that, please post it as well.
Thanks and regards,
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
it's right here Mack
http://www.antique-used-tools.com/stantms.htm
Hey, thanks much! I looked at Bob's site yesterday; I was pretty sure that's where I saw the trade marks. I guess my patience/visual acuity quotient was way low! LOL
Thanks again!
Mack"Close enough for government work=measured with a micrometer, marked with chalk and cut with an axe"
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