Does any one know what sort of glue to use for guitar?
I got a Martin D-28 folk guitar and the herring bone mouldings surrounding the sides of guitar are loose and I like to glue them back. Also the bridge of the guitar need gluing in the future.
Would Titebond, Pro bond or other wood glue do?
epo
Replies
If I was lucky enough to own a D-28, I would not do my own gluing. Shouldn't be all that expensive to have a guitar expert do this for you. You own a classic, and it deserves expert care (been there, done that, and was more than willing to pay)
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hi,
Thanks. Will keep in mind. My problem is I'm in Singapore ( South East Asia end) not as in the USA or UK. Don't have or rather do not know of any guitar expert who can repair here.
epo
Ooooh, bummer. OK, do a Google search on "guitar repair glue" or some such string. Read carefully, there should be some info in there. There is undoubtedly a forum that deals with guitar making. We get more violin posts here, it seems. Kinda odd.
Good luck. You've got a nice instrument there.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Like forestgirl said: "You own a classic, and it deserves expert care"
While the bindings aren't as much of an issue, at the very least you shouldn't attempt to do the bridge re-glue unless you know what you're doing. Any minor alignment mistake and the intonation and tuning will suffer. If the bridge is lifting, it's also possible there's a problem with bracing coming loose under the top.
You should really take some digital pics of the problem areas, then hop on to something like one of these forums to get some advice from pro luthiers
http://p084.ezboard.com/btheunofficialmartinguitarforum
http://luthierforum.com/index.php?showforum=6
I love the smell of sawdust in the morning.
Found myself thinking about this more last night. Surely there are professional guitar players in Singapore, right? They should know where there is a skilled repair person. That how I found the right person to repair a botched pick-up installation on my Guild back in the late '70's.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Epo,
I concur with other posters that if this is a valuable instrument you should try to find an expert to do the repairs.
If, out of necessity, you are going to do the repairs yourself, there is only one glue that you can use safely, and that is animal hide glue. Hide glue has been the standard for building and repairing musical instruments for centuries, if for no other reason than it the only glue that can be softened and removed if further repairs need to be done later.
Using any other glue risks permanently damaging the guitar or at least making further repairs in the future more difficult and expensive. The critical elements of you instrument were almost certainly assembled using hide glue.
Hide glue needs to be heated in a glue pot before it is applied, but with luck you will be able to find a local cabinetmaker who still use this traditional glue for his own work and he will be able to help you with the repair. There is version of hide glue sold in stores that doesn't need heating, but I wouldn't use this except as a last resort, but it would still be safer for the instrument than any other type of glue.
Good luck, John W.
P.S. Guitars may not be that common in your area of the world, but violins are, anyone repairing violins should have no problem working on a guitar although they may not know about the nuances of setting a bridge. At least they could probably be trusted not to do any permanent damage.
Edited 1/13/2005 1:36 pm ET by JohnW
Hey John
Up until fairly recently, I would have agreed with all you said about hide glue. But I've been visiting some of the luthier forums for 3-4 months, researching and preparing for eventually building my own mandolin. I was really surprised to find quite a number of very experienced builders/repairers that have the opinion that removing parts glued on with hide glue are some of the toughest. What I thought was the holy grail of never-come-apart glue - epoxy - is apparently one of the easier ones to remove. Go figure.
Anyway, from what I've seen on the forums, glue use on instruments seems to run the gamut - often with multiple purpose specific types used by the same builder on the same instrument. There's quite a bit of use of CA glues for bindings/purflings as well as hide and epoxy. Obviously builders have their favorites, but I see PVA, hide, epoxy, CA, and occasionally polyurethane (for oiler woods) recommended for various wood parts. It sure has made the research on my mando project a lot more complicated.
I've seen more than one discussion along those lines, but the last one I could remember well enough to find a link to is:
http://www.mandolincafe.net/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?s=dca0718565a1ae9650f82fe463877fba;act=ST;f=7;t=20482;hl=fret+board+glue
Doug S.
I love the smell of sawdust in the morning.
Edited 1/13/2005 2:08 pm ET by douglas2cats
Doug,
I wouldn't pretend to be an expert on the current state of the art in building musical instruments. In fact, I was pretty sure that some of the new adhesives must have their uses for luthiers.
I made my recommendation knowing that hide glue would do an adequate repair with the least chance of doing permanent harm to a nice instrument.
Thanks for the link to the web site.
John W.
As was mentioned, there are Martin lovers all over the world and Singapore shouldn't be any different. Go to some of the sites and ask where the people near you go for repairs. If it's at all possible, you can send it to the factory, too. You said "I got a Martin D-28". Does this mean you have had one for a while or you got it recently? If you're the original owner, the warranty is lifetime. If it costs you $100 to ship it to the factory in Nazareth, PA, it will be worth it since they take so much pride in their instruments. Is the loose binding and bridge recent? Could it be from a rapid change in humidity or have you been in Singapore long?
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Thank very much to all with their comments and advice. I decided not to repair my Martin guitar by myself any more. I'll probably look for Martin's website for more information on where to repair their guitars.
Thanks again to all.
epo
Good luck, epo, and thanks for checking here with your question. Although I loved my Guild (and it proved to be a solid investment when I could no longer play), I always longed to own a Martin. Enjoy!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
What model of Guild was it and why can't you play?
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
Model.....hmmmm.......I wanna say D-45, but I sold it awhile ago, and the memory isn't great. I bought it from an about-to-be-married serviceman in the late 1970's, he'd had it for 7 years. Gorgeous tone.
I wasn't a good guitar player, but enjoyed singing, so had a trio back in those days, and I played rhythm. Over the years, though, I overworked my hands (typing, taking care of horses, loading and unloading hay, typing, pushing wheelbarrows, typing -- you get the idea) and between carpal tunnel syndrome and super-bad tendinitis, playing the guitar got to be a no-go.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Sorry you had to stop playing. I've beaten my hands to death too, but fortunately can still play. Narfing my left index finger with a T&G bit on my router in February wasn't a good thing but I got lucky there. Not much real damage. Got my first guitar from an uncle in PHX who had rheumatoid so bad it was amazing he could do anything.
"I cut this piece four times and it's still too short."
epo,
It doesn't matter what may be the best glue to use now, if you were building a new guitar. What matters is what glue Martin used and therefore what you will be dealing with already on the guitar.
Martin used hide glue prior to about 1950. After that they used PVA glues, and may have used CA glue on purfling and trim if the guitar is recent. A herringbone purfling pattern may indicate a guitar of early vintage, but Martin began making "herringbone models" again in the 80s. Do you know the age of your guitar?
Martins have a serial number stamped inside on the end of the neck glue block. There are Martin-oriented web sites (mostly "collector" sites) that list the age of Martin instruments by serial number.
Both hide and PVA glue (as well as epoxy) can be loosened and reactivated by heat. I strongly urge you not to undertake this project unless you have a lot of experience using glues under heat or instrument repair or both.
You may be able to gently re-adhere the purfling with heat alone. Or you may need to gently lift the prurfling and trim back to sound glue, clean out any glue, and reglue. It is VERY easy to break the trim as it will be brittle. A Martin guitar is NOT a guitar to learn repair on.
But I recommend you send the instrument to the Martin factory for repair. You will have to call them first. Or ask them for the name of an authorized Martin repair shop. They are world-wide. Martin often warranties their instruments "for-ever" and may authorize the repair. They will not accept any shipments during winter months as instruments suffer when exposed to extreme changes of temperature and humidity during shipment.
Rich
Edited 1/13/2005 3:03 pm ET by Rich14
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