Replies

1. 
   Samson | Dec 04, 2007 10:58pm | #1

   8/4 means a nominal 2 inches thick.  In other words, the rough cut lumber is eight quarters of an inch (2 inches) thick coming out of the saw mill.  Once planed down, the wood will be more like 1 and 3/4 inches thick.

   "set on edge" means to orient the baord so that if you were placing it on a workbench or the floor, for example, it would be resting on it's narrow long edge.  When making a bench top the wide faces of several boards oriented in this manner are glued together to make the top.

1. 
   MatWood | Dec 05, 2007 01:08am | #5

   I am overwhelmed ! Thank you for all these careful explanations! There are so many things to learn for me, and I am glad to have found your help on this newsgroup.

   Take care

   - Mat

1. 
   philip | Dec 05, 2007 11:30am | #6

   Mat, welcome to this forum.
   I was in Geneva about one year ago and saw some very fine woodwork.
   Now that "we" understand the 8/4 thing and the American board system let us be thankful that we prefer the metric system-it is so concise and easy to apply ....(;) (;)Philip Marcou

1. 
   MattInPA | Dec 05, 2007 11:07pm | #10

   how are lumber dimensions specified down there?

1. 
   philip | Dec 06, 2007 03:27am | #16

   Matt,
   As far as I know if one buys imported graded timber from established suppliers they use the system familiar to me which is metric based so standard nominal thicknesses are 19mm, 25mm,38mm,50mm and 75mm for joinery and cabinet makers.
   But anyone who is in the industry also seems to be familiar with the 4/4 system as well or just plain old inches and feet. But it seems that a cubic meter is seen as a more convenient measure of timber volume. I am not sure that the average woodworm would know (or care) how many cubic meters equal 1000 board feet.
   I like the cubic meter-easy to correlate: roughly 1 ton of heavyish wood, or a pick up truck load.Philip Marcou

2. 
   SgianDubh | Dec 06, 2007 03:40pm | #17

   "I am not sure that the average woodworm would know (or care) how many cubic meters equal 1000 board feet."

   I guess I'm not the average 'woodworm' then philip, ha, ha. This kind of information is meat and drink to me, but I've had to live, work and use three types of measurement units, ie, Imperial, American, and metric in different countries.

   For fellow anoraks of an anal tendency with their broken specs held together with sticky tape  the numbers are, approximately, 2.358 m3 or 83.28 ft3. Slainte.

   Richard Jones Furniture

   Edited 12/6/2007 7:45 am by SgianDubh

3. 
   astro | Jan 22, 2008 07:45am | #18

   For a good laugh and the basics on wood terminology for a beginner, you might want to check out one of the wood whisperer videos called "That lumbering feeling." http://www.thewoodwhisperer.com.

   Rick

2. 
   KiddervilleAcres | Dec 04, 2007 11:13pm | #2

   Hi Mat,

   Welcome to Knots.  If you're interested in the different types of boards, here's a good explanation:

   http://www.allwoodwork.com/article/woodwork/plainorquartersawn.htm

   Regards,

   Bob @ Kidderville Acres

    

   A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!

3. 
   Samson | Dec 04, 2007 11:15pm | #3

   Here's a quick diagram that may help:

    

   
4. 
   saschafer | Dec 04, 2007 11:25pm | #4

   4/4, 8/4, etc. are representations of the thickness of a board, given in inches. Therefore, 4/4 stock is 1 inch thick, 8/4 stock is 2 inches thick, etc. This system of measurement is used for rough-sawn stock. Once surface-planed, the stock will be somewhat thinner. For example, surfaced 4/4 stock is usually 3/4" or 13/16" thick, surfaced 8/4 stock is usually 1-3/4" thick, etc.

   "On edge" means that the boards are rotated 90°, so that what was previously the face side of the board is now perpendicular to the finished face of the bench. See the attached sketch.

   -Steve

    

   
5. 
   danmart | Dec 05, 2007 04:53pm | #7

   Ciao Mat

   Ich wohnte in Kublis die Schweiz für ein Jahr als junger Reisender. Mein Deutsch ist jetzt sehr arm, aber hoffnungsvoll kann ich bei den angebrachten Fotos helfen. Ihr Englisch ist viel besser als mein Deutscher, aber ich wollte mein bestes nach allen diesen Jahren.

    

   spater

   dan

   
6. 
   joinerswork | Dec 05, 2007 09:15pm | #8

   All,

   As a bit of trivia, the 4/4, 5/4, 6/4, 8/4 terminology goes back to the old days of circular sawmilling.  The sawyer would refer to a board graduated in 1/4" increments,  ( "quarters") having a pointer- connected to the saw's carriage- indicating where on the log the saw would make the next cut.  By advancing the carriage (sideways) the sawyer regulated the thickness of each individual board before advancing the carriage (endwise) into the blade.

   Ray

1. 
   mufti | Dec 05, 2007 09:55pm | #9

              Ray, are you being entirely truthful in stating your age in your profile?

   How did they accurately size those blocks for the pyramids?

1. 
   saschafer | Dec 06, 2007 12:04am | #11

   It is a little-known fact that each of the blocks in the Great Pyramid of Giza is exactly 1 Ray Pine tall by 1.618 Ray Pines wide, a ratio known as the Golden Pine.

   -Steve

    

1. 
   Samson | Dec 06, 2007 12:15am | #12

   View Image

   A picture of Ray back in the day.  He's the one with his back to us in the upper right pulling the rope.  Nice diaper, Ray.  ;-)

1. 
   joinerswork | Dec 06, 2007 01:13am | #14

   Thanks a pantload, Sam.

   Ray

2. 
   Samson | Dec 06, 2007 01:18am | #15

   Whew, that was a serious outloud laughing fit.  Thanks!

2. 
   joinerswork | Dec 06, 2007 01:12am | #13

   mufti,

   Not that old, but here in Va, we never throw anything away.  I've been around some old mills, still in operation.

   The answer to sizing the blocks, is "depends".  See Samson's picture for details.

   Ray

   Edited 12/5/2007 5:15 pm ET by joinerswork

3. 
   bigfootnampa | Jan 22, 2008 05:23pm | #19

   The pyramid blocks were cast in place of geopolymer cements.  This accounts for their fantastic fit as the blocks on either side and below were used as the walls and floor for forming the new block.  This also explains how such large blocks were transported (in cart and sack loads as sandy aggregates).  Their construction benefited from the unusual efficiency of having a vast supply of limestone crumble available in the local area (desert sands).  Recent application of micro-analysis of these blocks has finally made it possible to determine this and reenactments have created modern versions of these "stones".

   www.geopolymer.org/archaeology/<!---->pyramids/are-pyramids-made-out-of-concrete-1

   Edited 1/22/2008 9:25 am ET by bigfootnampa

1. 
   mufti | Jan 22, 2008 07:35pm | #20

              Now that is information with a difference, thank you!

   On another tack, are you suggesting the best joints will result from growing and intertwining or grafting seedlings to grow furniture?

1. 
   saschafer | Jan 22, 2008 07:44pm | #21

   The historical precedent from the ancient Egyptians would suggest that the best way to make furniture is to grind up the wood and press the slurry into molds.

   -Steve

    

2. 
   MikeHennessy | Jan 22, 2008 07:47pm | #22

   "On another tack, are you suggesting the best joints will result from growing and intertwining or grafting seedlings to grow furniture?"

   I was thinking of posting in the poll thread about the stongest joint that many of the joints in wooden sailing vessels were made directly from the crotches of trees. So, shipbuilders pretty much did just that on a fairly large scale.

   Joints don't get much stronger that a crotch from a live oak.

   Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA

3. 
   mufti | Jan 22, 2008 10:28pm | #23

              And you should have so done Mike, but I would use a freshly felled tree, suitably trimmed, otherwise the roots and foliage might get in the way.