To all of those who mill lumber or have it milled to their specs, what thickness do you generally mill it to and do you use a bandsaw or chainsaw mill? Is the decision based on wasting less wood, the thickness of material you normally use, or something else?
Most of the lumber I deal with is 2″ thick and some is 2-1/2″ or 3″. The logic behind this is that it is less prone to warping and even if (when) it does, it will yeild a thicker board. Also, it is cut with a chainsaw which has a kerf of .404″, so I get more wood from the log this way.
Chris @ www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
– Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. – Albert Schweitzer
Replies
Chris,
I use a RipSaw, which is basically a chainsaw driven bandsaw. It's kerf is smaller than a chainsaw, but in the scope of a log...it doesn't gain much. I generally cut flitches 2" thick, but allow 4" through the center of the log. It takes longer to dry, but I find the 4" cut to be very stable and very useful. As far as the 2" cuts, it allows you to resaw it into 4/4 stock if thats what you need. It's easier to resaw 8/4 stock than it is wish a pile of 4/4 was thicker.
Take care Chris,
Sean
Thanks Sean, that's exactly what I was looking for. Chainsaw driven bandsaw? I get a picture of a bandsaw mill with a chainsaw engine attached to one wheel. Never heard of or seen one before.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
I also use a RipSaw and basically I mill in increments of 1 1/8 inch; that is 1 1/8 for 4/4, 2 1/4 for 8/4, etc. While this seems a large waste of wood when you get ready to use it, my experience is such that on stock that twists substantially, you need this much extra thickness to allow you to surface to the appropriate thickness. Much of this probably depends on what type of wood you are milling and how you dry it. If you sticker your drying stack properly and weight it down, most woods dry fairly flat without a lot of deformation. However some woods (yellow birch is my biggest problem) just want to curl up into propellers no matter what I do. I do have some 4 1/2 inch cherry stock drying now and it is going to take a long time for it to be usable. You also need to be aware that resawing thick sawn lumber releases a lot of tension in wood ultimately leading to some twisty lumber. For that reason, I try to mill to a variety of thicknesses and leave plenty of extra for surfacing after it is dry. By the way, just Google RipSaw and you will find their website.
That ripsaw certainly looks interesting. Good for narrower cuts. It's not suited to milling a slab table top, but perfect for lumber. A .050" kerf certainly beats a .404" kerf. It's not cheap, though, but nothing is.
As they say, when life give you lemons, make lemonade. I recently got a really twisted and cupped cherry slab. I think I'll make it into a table base. A friend of mine grabbed a super twisted 2x4 and added a couple hooks at the top, turning it into a coat rack. The lumber company Canfor offered to buy it from him.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Chris,
Why not consider the established industry standards on thicknesses for furniture making?
Some years ago we ordered red oak prime and comsels grade from Baillie Lumber in the U.S. The nominal thicknesses were 25 mm, 32mm, 38mm and 75mm (inch, inch and quarter, inch and half, two inch, three inch) which we applied to Imbuia from Brazil. As far as I know these are still standard nominal rough sawn thicknesses. By nominal is meant that theoretically a board graded as 25mm is actually sawn at around 28 to 30mm thick to allow a finished thickness of 25mm. The nominal thickness can vary with the species and source-some timbers need to have greater allowance on thickness to finish to standard thickness. In practice most factories finish say one inch stock at around 20 to 22 mm.
As for the rest of your question:conversion via chainsaw is wasteful that is why they only like to cut thick slabs. Now you go and buy thick stuff and you are the one paying for waste when you resaw to thinner stuff....Not to mention cupping etc associated with deep ripping. Far better to purchase r/s lumber in various nominal thicknesses. For standard furniture making you will find that the most used nominal thickness is 25mm or inch stuff. When I was making lots of furniture and using Iroko I would buy 70% of r/s stock at 25mm and the rest split over 2 inch and inchand half..
I don't agree with you when you say the thicker it is the less it warps. It is the same old story: "Get the best grade you can, either k/d or air dried, preferably selected by you (each and every board) and stack it properly before use".Neither do I see how you get the most from a log by sawing with a chainsaw- the bandsaw is the one to do that, with it's thin kerf and ability to saw straight.
Hope that is all intelligible and useful.
I am addressing you here as if you are making normal furniture- if this is not the case then I still say that the correct way to go is to have the lumber converted into a range of thicknesses suited (as near as possible to finished thickness after allowance for planing) to your operation , then correctly stack for drying. You should not be thinking of deep ripping thick stuff at a later stage when it is dry.
Philip,
Thanks for a very helpful response.
I don't get my lumber like most other woodworkers. Generally, I get it in flitches: a whole section of tree trunk almost from bark to bark. Slabbed, as you might call it. I am beginning to get a true understanding of the "ideal" ways to mill lumber. For narrower boards, a bandsaw mill is idea, as long as you can get the log to the mill. That's primarily why a chainsaw is used: accessability. It's obviously easier to move a 5000lb tree trunk in 20 slabs than as one piece. The other reason to use a chainsaw is its ability to cut extra-wide boards where it would not be desirable to do so. For example, a 4' wide crotch. I've heard stories of cutting 10' wide slabs with a chainsaw. That's quite a cut! So the conclusion that I am being drawn to is that for maximum quality yield, a bandsaw mill should be used for unspectacular and narrower boards. A chainsaw is the tool of choice when extra-wide boards are needed.
You're right, most of the stock I use is right around 4/4. Though I also use a lot of 10/4 or 8/4 stock for legs. By having 10/4 stock milled and dried, there is a risk of it warping after being resawn to 4/4, resulting in too thin of a board once trued up. So I think that I'll try to get 5/4" and 10/4 stock.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Do you cut free hand with your chainsaw, or use one
of the Alaskan sawmill attachments?
I've tried ripping some large pine logs (length wise) and
found it slow going. Do you have a special chain for rip cut? In short this topic is of major importance to me, any and all
insight would be appreciated.
Henley,
I don't mill lumber myself, though I have helped my friend who uses an Alaskan mill. He uses a rip chain and highly recommends using one for milling lumber. He does occaisonally rip freehand for cuts where he can't be bothered to set up the mill (firewood) or for cuts wider than his longest bar (72") is long. Of course, the mill occupies about 6" of bar space.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Yeah I think my 52cc. Husky is a bit small for the task.
It'll run a 20" bar but those long rips might heat it up
something fierce.
Freehand is not all that bad, but my skills are still a
tad lacking.
I think I'll order a rip blade and see how it goes.
Thanks
Chuck
Chris - I use an Alaskan lumber mill (http://www.granberg.com for those interested) and a Stihl 066 Magnum (it's just a bit too small to put wheels on and ride to work, but only just). If you decide to purchase one of these for yourself, remember that almost any homeowner or farm-sized chain saw will not have adequate power. You need a BIG saw, one that's capable of running a 4 foot long bar at the minimum. Anything smaller will be extremely tiresome to use (it's agonizingly slow), and potentially will just wear out the saw. Generally, these saws run around $800 and up. The RipSaw will operate with a considerably smaller chainsaw motor, as it takes a lot less power to drive the much thinner blade.
I generally flitch-cut or "boule-saw" the logs with this tool, and I never saw less than 12/4, and most of the time am sawing 16/4. The reason is exactly as you state - the kerf on the chainsaw takes out a lot, and my main objective is to break the wood down to pieces small enough to get it out of the woods. I then take some of the 16/4 to a guy with a Woodmizer, and have him cut the 16/4 into either one 4/4 and one 12/4, or two 8/4 slabs, depending on the species.
Regarding stability, wood is no more/less stable in different thicknesses. It's a volume percentage thing. That does mean that one of the surfaces of a thicker piece is likely to cup measurably more across the face than a thinner piece, because there's less wood shrinking in the thinner piece.
That said, I find little problem with cupping so long as the wood is stacked, stickered and covered within a day of being cut from the log.
Chris,
In an attempt to answer your original question I can only respond by saying to mill it bigger than your intended final result. Now there's something you can hang your hat on!?......
I guess I'm fortunate in that I buy logs from relatives who steer me to what I'm looking for both in species and figure. From there I transport it to a sawyer who will mill it to my own specifications. He charges me 17¢/ bf for sawing and 20¢/ bf for kiln drying. I get my wood in 1/8" increments in terms of thicknesses; edges can be natural or sawn.
I get these prices because I am his helper moving and stickering the boards, removing the outside slab wood and cleaning up the resultant mess. The slabwood becomes firewood (hardwood) or kindling (softwood) and the chickens and horses get the sawdust.
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob,
That's not a bad deal you've got going there. I get lumber in payment for that Dogwood table I built last Christmas. And it's still coming! I just got about 2000lbs of spalted maple in slabs about 7' long by 25+" wide.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
Chris,
When I mill logs, I mostly 5/4, and always have some 8/4 sawn from the larger logs. I hardly ever use 3/4" finished stock, as all of my doors and face frames for cabinets are 7/8" finished thickness, and my table tops are 1 1/8" finished. It's not easy to get 7/8" finished thickness from 4/4 rough stock, and the 5/4 thickness easily allows for this. There's definately more waste this way, but the results of the finished work require it.
Jeff
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled