Replies

1. 
   jeffn7 | Oct 07, 2002 11:36pm | #1

   Titebond II Extend, 15 minute working time vs. 5 minutes for Titebond II

1. 
   badoyn | Oct 07, 2002 11:48pm | #2

   Hmmm. Never knew that one existed.

   Thanks,

   Michael

1. 
   LeeEschen | Oct 07, 2002 11:55pm | #3

   It's relatively new and many home improvement centers may not have it yet. Woodworking specialty places should have it, however.

   BTW, original Titebond has a longer open time than Titebond II, perhaps 10 min rather than the 5 min of the type II.

2. 
   DennisS | Oct 08, 2002 06:53am | #4

   Even though I rehearse my glue-ups, it often takes more than 15 min. to assemble some of the staved turning pieces I've been working on. I've taken to using the powdered resin glue which seems to take all night to set up! It's somewhat messy and will really stick to about anything it touches. I don't see it mentioned much in this discussion group so I'm wondering why more people don't use it???

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

1. 
   silver77 | Oct 08, 2002 07:15am | #6

   I used to use titebond II but now have upgraded to plastic resin glue(also known as marine glue).Titebond II is water resistant but plastic resin is waterproof and has an open time of 4-8 hours which is handy for exterior doors or anytime you need longer working time...I find it no problem to mix up a batch and it does clean up with water when it's wet.

   silver  

1. 
   Schenker15 | Oct 08, 2002 06:02pm | #7

   Silver,

   I'm very interested in this subject.  I usually use Titebond II, but I find that it sets up a little too quickly for some of my projects.

   Is plastic resin glue just as strong as Titebond II?

   Do you know a good source for this kind of glue?

   Thanks!

1. 
   silver77 | Oct 09, 2002 08:11am | #13

   Matthew,

    I live in a one horse kind of town and buy plastic resin glue at a fancy finish lumber store. Any large lumber or hardware store should carry it...It says marine glue on the label. If you know a serious woodworker, he may have some in bulk. I haven't found a down side but as pointed out don't breathe the powder when mixing and wear a dust mask when sanding.

   To get lumpfree glue: start with less water, get all the powder wet and stir it into a ball. Then slowly stir in the rest of the water ,wait about 15 minutes and it's ready to use. I find it a pleasurable glue experience...so far hard to beat.

   As strong or stronger than Titebond II which is 3500#psi if memory serves me correctly.

   regards,

   silver

   Edited 10/9/2002 1:14:51 AM ET by silver

3. 
   SgianDubh | Oct 08, 2002 07:09am | #5

   Both liquid hide glue and polyurethane glue will give you about 20 minutes to fiddle at about 70°F, and longer at lower temperatures. Both are very strong if applied correctly, assembled as per instructions, and cramped up correctly. Polyurethane glue is reputed to be 'waterproof' but that claim seems a bit dubious (to me.)

   Website
1. 
   DennisS | Oct 08, 2002 06:15pm | #8

   Sgian -

   I used Poly glue (Gorrila Glue) in an experiment bending a pitch change for an exterior stair railing. This piece was bent first for the vertical pitch change then re-sawn and bent 'round a form for the horizontal bend. From redwood. No, not the best choice of wood for steam bending but ... the point is, after re-sawing the first laminations to 1/4" and steaming for 15 minutes, I didn't lose one joint. I've also 'tested' different species of wood using poly glue by leaving them submerged in water for as much as a week at a time with absolutely no degredation of the glue joint.

   I went away from it due to the mess that ensues when the stuff foams up. The plastic resin glue seems to withstand water (haven't tried temperature yet) as well and is easier to work with. Also, once opened, the poly glues don't have much of a shelf life if not carefully stored to eliminate air from the squeeze bottle.

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

1. 
   SgianDubh | Oct 09, 2002 07:57am | #12

   Dennis, thanks for that feedback on your experience regarding its (polyurethane's) ability to be waterproof. I just wasn't convinced. What's your take on it's claimed gap filling abilities? It seems to be mostly foam that fills any gaps, similar to insulating foam.

   White (mineral) spirits will remove the stuff from your hands as long as you get at it right after the glue-up job. Slainte.Website

4. 
   HowardAcheson | Oct 08, 2002 07:28pm | #9

   Another choice is standard white PVA glue. It has about double the open time of yellow PVA and is less expensive than polyurethane adhesive or Titebond Extend.

   Urea Plastic Resin is good to as it has a fairly long open time. It's a powder and can be somewhat dangerous if you inhale the dust. Use a mask when you mix it.

   Finally, go through a couple of dry fits to get the most efficient process established. Also, see if there isn't some way to glue up sub-assemblies that are more manageable.

   
   

   ---

   Edited 10/8/2002 12:29:42 PM ET by Howie

1. 
   badoyn | Oct 08, 2002 10:44pm | #10

   Thanks to all for the replies. It looks like I might test the poly glue (Gorilla) and the plastic resin glue.

   Sheesh, it's amazing what you have to go through just so I don't have to rush the glue up. That is the part that bothers me the most.

   Thanks,

   Michael

1. 
   Trees2dust | Oct 09, 2002 01:16am | #11

   Michael,

   I was going to post a question like yours, but I didn't get a chance to and just went ahead and glued up my project last weekend.  It's a chair, actually a stool with turned legs and rungs, with thru-mortised/wedged tenons.  Since all the joints are compound-angled, it all locks together and the parts had to be assembled at the same time and pushed in gradually.  I was afraid that if I used Titebond it would have locked up on me during assembly.

   I used epoxy since it has a long open time, could have fillers mixed in to fill gaps, and also because I'm familiar with the stuff, having used lots of it in boatbuilding.  A bad thing about epoxy- it soaks into bare wood and it's hard to clean up, so I pre-finished the parts first.  I brushed on straight epoxy (unthickened) to all the mortises and tenons first to allow it to soak in, then added a thickener to the rest of the batch (fine sawdust from the ROS dust canister) and applied the thickened epoxy to the mortises.  All the parts went together without a hitch, with plenty of open time to spare.  What a relief from those frantic glue-ups!

   Rick

5. 
   ChipTam | Oct 09, 2002 01:46pm | #14

   I would second Rick's reply about epoxy.  I've been using epoxy for 15 years for all glue ups which involve more than a few minutes of open time.  You can invest in something like the West System but for most glue ups the small tubes of 2-ton epoxy work just fine.  You'll get about 30 minutes of open time.  I find that clean up is easier than with most other types of glue.  Also, if you miss a fleck of glue during clean up, it usually won't telegraph through the finish like other glues.

1. 
   badoyn | Oct 09, 2002 04:56pm | #15

   What's the West System?

   Michael

1. 
   UncleDunc | Oct 09, 2002 10:09pm | #16

   It's a family of epoxy glues, additives, and tools for a variety of different applications, made by Gougeon Brothers. A web search for epoxy and either West System or Gougeon Brothers should turn up something. Five years ago, they used to have a free information packet that included several samples in condiment packets.

2. 
   AlanTurner | Oct 10, 2002 10:02pm | #18

   A wonderful company.  Jamestown Distributors sells West.  The nicect thing is that the mix ratio of the two liquids is handled by a separate pump, one in each can, and then the ratio is one to one.  I used this on a set of spanish cedar garden benches and was well satisfied.

6. 
   logcabin | Oct 09, 2002 11:13pm | #17

   Klingspor has recently come out with a long set time glue but I don't know how well it works or if it's water resistant.  Matter of fact, I don't know if their regular yellow glue is water resistant.  I bought a container of each the other day but haven't tried them yet.  Gotta wait for the Titebond II to run out.

   Tom from Clayton