Replies

1. 
   Elcoholic | Oct 13, 2003 11:02pm | #1

   Only if designed for use with the dye you using.  For instance you wouldn't want to use a pre-stain conditioner like Minwax with waterbase dye.  It might work with alcohol based dye or Solar Lux NGR though. 

   John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking

   Life is tough.  It's tougher if you're stupid - John Wayne

1. 
   BobfromCorrales | Oct 13, 2003 11:14pm | #2

   I should have made my self clearer.

   My question should  have stated : should I use a water based conditioner with water based aniline dyes?Bob in Corrales

1. 
   RMillard | Oct 14, 2003 02:04am | #3

   I often apply a coat of distilled water on endgrain before applying the dye, to help prevent it from getting too dark. Actually dye is pretty good at coming out evenly, on endgrain. With blotch prone woods like cherry or maple, I apply a coat of thinned down hide glue as a conditioner, as this does wonders for achieving a even finish. I’m not much on spraying, but I do spray dyes on woods like cherry and maple, using fairly high pressure and very low flow, to help in getting even coloring. I can’t ever recall dyeing pine, other than to “age” the inside of drawers, so my experience is limited but I think the hide glue size would be the best bet. Test this out first on scrap, since it will alter the intensity of the dye, making it lighter.

   Rob Millard

1. 
   BobfromCorrales | Oct 14, 2003 06:17am | #4

   Thanks, that's what I needed to know.Bob in Corrales

2. 
   AlanTurner | Oct 15, 2003 04:24pm | #5

   Rob,

   What an interesting idea.  What is the proportion of hide glue to water that you are using?  Do you use distilled water for the sizing?  And, when you spray the dye, do you mix the dye with water, or alcohol?  I recall, I think, that you use the Transtints, from Homestead.

   Alan

1. 
   Jeffj | Oct 19, 2003 10:56pm | #6

   If you use a water based dye, you can make your own conditioner by mixing 1 part w/b finish to 1-2 parts water. The less water you use, the darker the dye will color.

   Apply the water base/water mix liberally to the wood - just like when you raise the grain. Wipe off any excess quickly and allow it to dry 4-6 hrs. Sand the wood smooth again with 320 and then apply your dye.

   Jeff

2. 
   RMillard | Oct 20, 2003 01:04pm | #7

   S4S,

   I use distilled water. I have not really measured the ratio ( I know I should), but I would guess it to be about 10 parts water to 1 part liquid hide glue. When I spray the dyes, I use the water based type. I have used the NGR dyes, but even with a respirator they make me deathly sick. I read in one of Jeff Jewitts books, about spraying the dyes on carefully, so that you need not wipe the excess off. He observed that wiping the dye is what caused the splotching. He is of course correct, but I have to do some minor wiping and the results are excellent any way. You are correct about me using the Trans Tint Dyes, they make up 99.9% of my wood coloring. They are excellent, being versatile and giving a great, stable color. No single item has done more to improve my finishes.

   Rob Millard