Replies

1. 
   migraine | Oct 17, 2003 04:53pm | #1

   I'm on the west coast and I think they were sold out within about a half hour, or that's when I logged on to see what else they were selling

2. 
   riverr1 | Oct 17, 2003 05:16pm | #2

   Doug,

   This whole thing was a lesson to me to not post some information. I called and talked to the local woodcraft yesterday and was told that store sales and internet sales were not to start until 10:35 am this morning. That's what they were told. That is also why they had the email reminder. Basically, even though it said 12:00 am on the internet notice of the sale coming, that was not to indicate when the sale itself was to begin. I posted this info on woodnet. Didn't turn out this way did it? Also see that some where at the stores when they opened this morning and got the clamps for the sale price.

   Not sure where to place blame on this as it seems to be a big snafu somewhere. Problem is though, the sale is really from Jorgensen, not woodcraft so there is no way to back up and correct any errors.

   Don

1. 
   Dan019 | Oct 17, 2003 05:30pm | #3

   Agreed.

   The whole thing does seem like a scam, probably a way to get your email address so now all of us who got the reminder will be bombarded with ejunk from spammers. I got my notice and went to the site at 7am and was greeted with the sold out message. In retrospect it doesn't seem like a good way to atract business on their part. They probably p.o. more people than they pleased.

   Dan

1. 
   forestgirl | Oct 17, 2003 07:37pm | #6

   Dan, I agree with you that they probably PO'd an awful many people.  However, this sale didn't have anything to do with collecting email addresses for future junk spam purposes.

   Those of us who were real geared up for this sale were well aware that the email notification wasn't going to do a whit of good -- that the web site would be deluged with orders at 12:00:01 and we'd be lucky to get our orders through before they ran out.  I'm sorry you didn't pick that grapevine info up in the other thread.  forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

1. 
   efarmer4 | Oct 17, 2003 08:45pm | #13

   Woodcraft did set up their own Denial of Service (DoS) Attack. ; ) They could have made it more clear that it would end up a lottery of who got though! Or better yet just lower the discount to 10-20% so it wasn't such a great deal. I see it as more poor marketing then deceptive.

   The other problem I felt was the e-mail reminders didn't go out until after they were sold out, they should have started sending those earlier or at least stop sending them after the deal closed. I can see how that pissed people off. I never got any hint before reading this thread today that they might do it in the stores also, makes sense, but if I had known I'd have got up early today. But then I'd more pissed at driving to the store and not getting any clamps then over the internet, although the time wasted was almost the same...Edward

3. 
   Crunk | Oct 17, 2003 07:00pm | #4

   They suck.  The only people I do business with at this point are Garrett Wade and Dieter Schmid in Germany. 

4. 
   forestgirl | Oct 17, 2003 07:30pm | #5

   The clamp sale was definitely an exercise in frustration, but after re-visiting their web site this morning, I'm am much less inclined to think there's anything sinister going on here.

   As I posted in the other clamp thread, according to the web site, they sold through a 5-year supply of clamps in one (1) hour. 

   I think it would be a shame for Woodcraft clients to desert them because of this stampede of a sale!  They went waaaaay out on a limb stocking up that much inventory for a one-shot sale (and, hopefully you know that this Jorgenson thing is happening because Irwin bought them out and is changing over to their Blue and Yellow colors).  I suspect the avalanche of orders was even more and faster than they were expecting.  They probably did the best they could.

   I still don't know for positively sure that I got the 8 clamps that I ordered last night (I do know I didn't get 4 other ones), but despite my disappointment and exhaustion last night, I would not hold it against Woodcraft.  This clamp liquidation is more or less a once-in-a-lifetime thing.  That's just the way it goes.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

1. 
   riverr1 | Oct 17, 2003 07:37pm | #7

   Jorgensen is owned by the Adjustable Clamp Co. and has nothing to do with the Irvin thing. Lot's of speculation by some about why the sale. Clampman from Jorgensen says it a 100 year sale for customers. The Adjustable Clamp Company is 100 years old this year, and they are spreading the sale around to a number of their dealers. My thoughts on "Why" the sale are maybe since I've haven't seen these sizes for awhile, maybe there unwanted stock. 24's were replaced by 30's, 42's replaced 36's, etc. Who knows, maybe they are just being good to us, and if you make out great, if not, Que Sera. I haven't had the luck of right place, right time yet myself and even tried to prepare for this one, and things changed.

   Don

   Edited 10/17/2003 5:29:13 PM ET by Don C.

1. 
   forestgirl | Oct 17, 2003 07:56pm | #8

   OK, my bad as they say.  Was repeated erroneous info from another post evidently.  Your theory on the "why" of the sale makes perfect sense.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

1. 
   ToolDoc | Oct 17, 2003 07:59pm | #9

   JAMIE: Me thinks Don.C is right Irwin has nothing to do with Jorrgy there 2 diffrent companys..

                                                ToolDocProud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..

   A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..

2. 
   clampman2 | Oct 17, 2003 08:16pm | #11

   Don,

   If there is a "Clampman" from Jorgensen, he is not me.

   I didn't know there were any others around and don't want to get anyone confused on the issue.

   I'm Clampman from <a href="http://www.miterclamp.com/index.htm&quot; Miterclamp.com

   Thanks.

   Jim C

   Edited 10/17/2003 3:03:31 PM ET by clampman

1. 
   riverr1 | Oct 17, 2003 08:28pm | #12

   Wow! There is a regular participant on woodnet who is from Jorgensen. FG has been known to browse woodnet and I thought she would know who I was referring to. Never considered there being more then one of ya's.

   Don

1. 
   forestgirl | Oct 17, 2003 11:16pm | #17

   I missed something, I guess.  Totally clueless about what's being referred to here, LOL.  I hadn't been to Woodnet in so long, that when I went over the other day, I had to re-register -- they must have "purged" me from their system!  Ahhhh, how soon they forget.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   riverr1 | Oct 19, 2003 08:37am | #35

   FG,

   Funny how things go. I had never heard of Woodnet until you posted about it here. Your post at that time had to do with getting info from either the Delta guys or Charles. I got there from following you! ;*)....So, a belated thanks.

   This whole Jorgensen clamp thing with all the negative topic threads on many of these forums has me hoping that alot of the woodworkers posting here and elsewhere are less the 14 or 15, because if they aren't, how the heck are they getting through with everything else in life, and with what has to be more serious and pressing issues then a wood clamp sale. Some serious growing up is needed by what appears to be more then just a few.

   Using your words Jamie, and addressed to those posting.........."I will never shop at WoodCraft again,"............TOO FUNNY...........TOO SAD............

   Just my opinion. WoodCraft is customer oriented to a degree we should wishhope for from just too many other retail storesoutlets we have to deal with everyday.

   Don

   Edited 10/19/2003 1:39:39 AM ET by Don C.

3. 
   forestgirl | Oct 19, 2003 08:18pm | #37

   Don, I, too, have wondered how some of the folk cope with life's bigger issues.  I could get quite analytical here, but won't.  I tend to reserve my fighting energy for the 10% most important potential personal battles that present themselves, and find that it's the best use of my reserves.  I can count those battles without using my toes, but got a great deal of satisfaction out of winning them!

   HAH!  Just had an idea.  Those who have deserted every company in the marketplace due to perceived slights could form a co-op servicing their own purchasing needs:  The "Co-op of the Disenchanted and Those Unable to See Things From Another Perspective."  Wonder what their purchasing power would be?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

4. 
   ToolDoc | Oct 18, 2003 07:01am | #21

   DON: Your not NUTS!! There is a fellow over at WoodNet who posts as "ClampMan" form Jorrgy..

                                            ToolDocProud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..

   A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..

5. 
   forestgirl | Oct 18, 2003 07:30am | #22

   I introduced myself to the Woodnet Clampman today via email and invited him to stop by over here.  He probably didn't get the message before he left work though, as it was around 5pm here on the Left Coast.  Charles from Freud seemed to have survived being a Knothead, so I figure it's safe to invite another corporate type into our fold!  [disclaimer:  the Adjustable Clamp Company is evidently a privately held, family-owned business, so "corporate" may be a little strong]forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

6. 
   ToolDoc | Oct 18, 2003 03:29pm | #27

   Jamie: Sure had to go wondern over to WoodNet & use your "Womanly Charms" on us poor Manly Woodneters  to Lure us into your Knot Club House Huh//LOL...

   hmm while you were there you should of invited the Delta crew over too..

                                                ToolDocProud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..

   A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..

7. 
   forestgirl | Oct 18, 2003 06:25pm | #30

   Is the Delta contingent more than one person (Delta 007)??  I've often wondered why we never see him/them over here.  I'm glad I know where they are in case my planer goes nuts. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

8. 
   k9s | Oct 19, 2003 12:19am | #31

   Jamie--The other Delta guy is named Rock--they both hang out in the basement most of the time.

9. 
   ToolDoc | Oct 19, 2003 12:42am | #32

   Jamie: there is 2 of em Delta 007 & Rock2Car,Just post a Delta Queston they both will jump right in..Me thinks you should go on over & use your Forest Girly charm on those 2 Big Lugs & get em over here,Noticed Delta 007 posts at WWA..

                               ToolDocProud Member of the Delta & Klein Tradesman Club & Milwaukee HD Club & Knots Bad Boys & Girls Club..

   A Non ~ Member of the Knots Bandsaw Guru Club..

5. 
   richtes | Oct 17, 2003 08:16pm | #10

   Didn't you noticed all the noise about the Jorgy sales for the past few months? People have been posting about this for weeks, complaining about Amazon when they had their sale, and every other place that's been involved. This wasn't a scam from Woodcraft.

   The local store in my area had what looked like a couple of pallets of clamps for the sale.

   Not sure Jorgenson's done more harm than good to themselves as this has gone on. It's been like a derby.

   Rich

1. 
   DougF | Oct 17, 2003 08:55pm | #14

   All,

   When I started this I was aware of a "buyer beware" aspect but I do hold Woodcraft and anyother vendor resposnsible when they create an unreasonable demand for a limited supply of any product and then compound the injury by opening the "bidding" at midnight and subject the receipt of your based on the speed that your Internet ISP is able to transfer the email. 

   For the record, I do not blame Jorgenson since they did not create an unreasonable demand, Woodcraft performed that little deed.  I guess it boils down to the fact that there was not a level playing field.  Frankly, I have managed to survivi for 35 years of ww without their claimps and not being able to purchase them now has no impact other than not being able to add some quality clamps to my supply.  God knows, one never has enough clamps.  I simply believe that a company selling products has to be responsible for their actions and I am holding them responsible for what I consider a marketing blunder.  I guess I would have been less po'd about this if their notice informing me that the were sold out had not been immediately followed by an offer to sell me the identical clamps for 10% off the regular retail price.

   Thanks again for hearing me out and congratulations to those of you able to take advantage of the offer.

   Doug

1. 
   b1gcountry | Oct 17, 2003 09:18pm | #15

   I think Woodcraft's only mistake was making them go on sale at midnight, although, it might have been calculated so that it coincided with a low in internet activity.

   I think the limit of four clamps per person was a good idea, I don't think tool crib did that. I also have a feeling that the price for the clamps was dictated by Jorgenson, and Woodcraft probably did NOT have an option of discounting them to only 20 or 30 percent...although with the response this got, what difference would it have made?

   I got my clamps at the store, so I'm happy. It wasn't even a madhouse at this woodcraft.

   Tom

1. 
   mitch | Oct 17, 2003 09:44pm | #16

   The following is excerpted from my letter of complaint to Woodcraft:

   "While I fully recognize and understand that such a popular sale would likely causeyour website to run much more slowly than usual, I do not believe it isreasonable to expect it to so utterly and completely malfunction inprocessing a simple order, regardless of traffic volume.I first started the order process just a few seconds after midnight (and wehave a DSL line, so connection speed is not a problem) and your system wasimmediately running slower than molasses.  Okay, I would expect that.  WhatI didn't expect when I got through to the first step of checkout, was thefour or five router bits in my cart that I most definitely had not tried toorder, and one extra set of four clamps in one of the sizes.  So I had totry to clean that up by using the red X "remove" boxes but that either didnot work or was so slow I couldn't tell the difference.  I then decided tojust change the quantities of the unwanted items to zero, figuring yoursystem will figure it out.  Next I tried to proceed to checkout where Ineeded to change the name and address given to my own, not a Mr. Peck(Beck?) somewhere in California.  I have no idea where that came from but ofcourse that exercise wasted more precious minutes of my time.  (Keeping inmind, I got out of bed at a few minutes before midnight to play this dumbgame.)  Finally I proceed to checkout only to be met with the notice "Yourbasket is empty."  After all that hassle, your system tells me I haven'tbothered to actually order anything!  So I click on "Shopping Cart" andthere's my clamp order, more or less like I wanted it (it had somehow addedone or two more sets than I was allowed but I thought that could be sortedout later).  THREE TIMES I GO BACK TO CHECKOUT ONLY TO BE TOLD MY BASKET ISEMPTY!...  I fully realize that some, repeat, some, problems will crop up during an event such as your sale, but the total collapse of your system was inexcusable."

   I gave up in disgust after about a half hour.

   m

1. 
   chillywilly | Oct 20, 2003 05:21pm | #38

   I completed my order at approx 12:10 am.  I got an email this morning saying they were sold out.  How on earth could they have sold out of "5 years supply" in 10 minutes?

2. 
   mitch | Oct 20, 2003 05:45pm | #39

   had you already received an order confirmation before they cancelled on you?

   m

3. 
   chillywilly | Oct 20, 2003 06:04pm | #40

   The confirmation is actually where I found out about the cancellation!

   Here it is exactly as it was sent to me....

   The words "Order Cancelled" prompted me to call Woodcraft to find out what happened and they told me they were sold out.  I thought "Order Cancelled" was referring to the items I selected and later deleted from my order. 

   Thank you for ordering from Woodcraft, we have begun to process

   your order. You may check on the status of your order

   from our web site at http://www.woodcraft.com using the Order

   History link at the top of our homepage.

   You will receive another e-mail confirmation, containing shipping

   details, when your order is shipped. If you have questions, see

   our help page at http://www.woodcraft.com - respond to this

   email or call 800-535-4482.

   Woodcraft Customer Service

   Order Number:

   Order Date: 10/16/03

   Name and Address

   PRODUCT NUMBER/ (SEE UNIT

   DESCRIPTION BELOW) QUANTITY PRICE STATUS

   145324 1 4 14.99 ITEM CANCELED

   CABINET MASTER 24" 145336 1 4 16.99 ITEM CANCELED

   CABINET MASTER

   36INCH Merchandise Net: 0.00

   Tax Amt: 0.00

   Shipping Amt: 0.00

   Total Amt: 0.00

   Payments:

   Balance: 0.00

   *************************** SHIP TO ADDRESS LEGEND ***************************

   Ship To Address

4. 
   forestgirl | Oct 20, 2003 07:37pm | #41

   Ron, I suspect that glitches in the computer process ended up cancelling your clamp order.  We know for a fact that they didn't run out of stock in that first 10 minutes (too many reports from people who were successful after that).  There have been reports that indicate data problems during the frenzy of computer activity.  The letter you received stated the order was cancelled, not out of stock.

   Doesn't sound like WC's customer service has been very responsive to complaints about the clamp sale, but if you're nice to them and focus on the possibility that your order was mistakenly cancelled (not the out-of-stock issue), you might be able to work your way up the ladder to someone who will help.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   forestgirl | Oct 17, 2003 11:20pm | #18

   from another thread, author=me"

   I doubt that they have any in stock.  After lunch, if it's not busy at my store, I'll do a fake shopping spree for the clamps and see what happens.  My guess is, there aren't any.  The 10% off is for anything except power tools, $50 minimum."forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

1. 
   BG | Oct 17, 2003 11:35pm | #19

   Remember, the vast majority of Woodcraft Stores are not owned by Woodcraft, they are a franchise.  Imagine the squaking if Woodcraft central had kept all the clamps at the warehouse and sold on-line and denied their franchises the opportunity to offer the deal to their customers. 

1. 
   ssuser | Oct 18, 2003 06:12am | #20

   I tried to order the clamps last night at 9:30 pm pst and they sold out in 1/2 hour. My wife was waiting at the door of the local Woodcraft Store this morning along with a couple dozen others and I got 4 of each size. Actually I don't get them till Christmas. Its going to kill me.

2. 
   forestgirl | Oct 18, 2003 07:31am | #23

   Your wife sounds like a treasure!  (except for that part about making you wait until Christmas, LOL!)forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

3. 
   ssuser | Oct 18, 2003 07:52am | #24

   She is indeed, but she has a cruel steak. lol

4. 
   BG | Oct 18, 2003 12:40pm | #25

   ssuser,

   Bad, bad move ssuser....and what happens if your naughty between now and Christmas?....like too much candy at halloween...poof..the clamps are gone ...sent to Iraq for the rebuilding...lol...and, of course, the Sweeds will get the thanks...

5. 
   ssuser | Oct 18, 2003 04:19pm | #28

   Oh my gosh, never thought of that.  I will have to work the honey do list hard and furious.

6. 
   forestgirl | Oct 18, 2003 06:22pm | #29

   To Iraq?  Nah, don't think so.  I suspect some knothead (so-to-speak) will frame susser for a particularly terrible deed, then ride to the rescue of his LOML and be given the clamps in deep gratitude for his (or her, tee hee?) chivalry.  Look out, susser!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

7. 
   DaveMartins | Oct 19, 2003 01:50am | #33

   Yes it was pretty disturbing staying up to midnight just to find out is was all over at midnight central standard time were I live.  The next morning I went over to the local Woodcraft expecting to see a line of guys outside waiting to get in but was surprised to be only one of three in the store.  Plenty of clamps on hand, well 12 less after I had left.  I don't believe this was done on purpose just not thought out that well.  I'll bet ya it was the most clamps ever sold in a 24 hour period.

   Dave

2. 
   smijal | Oct 19, 2003 02:55am | #34

   ForestGirl,

   I was one of those whose sleep kept them from making the electronic pilgrimmage to the Woodcraft site. When I awoke at 5 am to get ready for work I was not suprised to fing they were sold out. Form the previous vendors's Jorgy sales (Amazon noted) the demand is high when the price is this good. Just chucked it off to the "missed another oportunity" category.

   Later at work during lunch I called the local Woodcraft and they did have some of each in stock. I did manage to get 6 held under my credit card number (essentially a "phone hold" and agreed to pick them up before closing (or I would lose them) Fair enough.

   I do not understand the sentiment in the thread blaming Woodcraft . They were up fron with all aspects of the sale. They offered to email reminders, supposedly assuming a 5 year suppuly would last a few days and give everyone a shot at them. Had they ordered a 2 or three month supply I might see them as non-prepared, but I think they did all they could in anticipation of the event. In retrospect, the electronic comunications of today (including this and other woodworking forums) is a cause of massive generation of interest--something we all willl lhave to deal with fro here on.

   Stan

1. 
   forestgirl | Oct 19, 2003 08:07pm | #36

   Stan, I agree with you that Woodcraft's not to blame for the clamps running out before demand did.  You are so smart -- great idea to put a "phone hold" on the clamps.  Going to WC in Seattle is at least a 4-hour ordeal for me because of having to take the ferry (only about 20 miles as the crow flies, but 9 miles of Puget Sound in between!).forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

6. 
   sailalex | Oct 18, 2003 03:18pm | #26

   Hey folks, this was a sale just like many other sales that have a limited supply. Everyone that is grown up has seen them; we see it at the grocery stores all the time with their "lost leaders" limited to x per customer. Woodcraft had a great sale that a limited number were able to take advantage of. The alternative was no sale at all! No deception, just a limited number that not everyone could access. I for one am happy to have a local store(franchise) that the staff are pleasant and provide access to tools that are not otherwise in my area.  

    I appreciate the "heads up" on this forum to even know it was on and from my local store I was able to get some clamps.

7. 
   bill_1010 | Oct 21, 2003 02:33am | #42

   Some win, some lose.  I lost, no biggie to me. It appears others thought that a great deal and just beat me to the deals. Win some lose some.   I generally dont shop woodcraft too much anyways, prices are a little high, and with stores in my state i pay both sales tax and shipping so its a little redundant.

1. 
   MarkC | Oct 21, 2003 04:41pm | #43

   This may clear up a few questions posed here:

   http://www.forums.woodnet.net/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=handtools&Number=658118&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=

   Clampman's explanation on the Woodnet board.