To all you woodworkers out there, I am curious to know what your interest in metalworking is. I don’t necessarily mean fabrication like you see on TV, but more along the lines of creating your own hardware for your projects.
Have you ever made your own hardware? Why or why not? If not, would you be willing to try?
Chris Wong
Chris @ flairwoodworks
Replies
Chris,
If some special metalwork is needed in woodworking, it would have to be very special to go make maybe "One of a Kind" pairs or hardware sets. One fellow asked if there was a way to gold plate some metal cabinet pulls to make his small project look richer and older from an old gold ring he found.
However, I'm a believer that blending different areas of metalworking, woodworking, plastics, electricity, and metal detecting can enrich the others and your project.
I welded my removable lumber storage arms and blended the wooden shelving to get heavy-duty storage for both kiln and green but air drying lumber. I wired the shop and storage area in the attic, and the lumber storage area for lights, a welder, and a small fans. I'm using curved plastics for windows to see inside my 55 gallon barrels of my dust collection I welded and assembled from flea market finds. From my metal detecting, the lost copper-clad coins I found over 4-1/2 years totaled over $850, and coming full circle, it helped buy a band saw.
At a garage sale, two Saturdays ago, I found a metal lathe's 4-jaw, 8" , American made chuck for only $5. It has an adapter plate with a 1-1/4" thread, but if I had a metal lathe, I could turn an adapter so I can use it on my 1" by 8tpi wood lathe.
Here again, one field of learning helps another....
Good luck on more opinions,
Bill
Do you have a face plate with 1x8 thread ?Remove the backplate,should have 3 or 4 screws in it. Center the chuck best you can on the faceplate. If the slotted holes will work ,then attach the chuck to the faceplate.If not, you have to layout new elongated holes.Use a dial indicator if you have one to get the chuck as close to the faceplate center as possible.
mike
"Have you ever made your own hardware? Why or why not? If not, would you be willing to try?"
Yes, I make special metal pulls often. Usually these are of mild steel. I do other custom metal fabrication as well.
Do you have a specific reason for wanting to know?
Sapwood,
As a woodworker, I've gotten hooked on metalworking myself in the last year or so. It started with making hardware that just can't be found. That has led to toolmaking (to a degree - no forging yet). To answer your question, I want to know if woodworkers are intimidated by metal and buy rather than make hardware or if we take it as a challenge and look to expand our knowledge base.Chris @ flairwoodworks
While my background is woodworking I did get a degree in sculpture with a lot of metalwork such as welding and casting. I also spent a number of years as a metalsmith making hardware and architectural jewelry from materials such as brass and stainless steel. Basic woodwroking shop equipment along with learning how to silver braze will allows one to make pretty much any kind of hardare from brass. The table saw cuts brass wonderfully with a negative hook blade. A router won't replace a milling machine but will do some things. A commercial horizontal slot mortiser running at 3,500 rpm will do more than a router.
I've done accent pieces to go on table bases as well as inlaid brass on table edges. Custom knife hinges and all sorts of decorative hardware and have a local plating shop that can do bright and polished nickel as well as black nickle. I've even had custom lamp parts gold plated as well as extensive patina work for brass, copper and bronze.
I will make hinges for projects when I can't find anything else to do what I need.
As Rick L above stated, knife hinges are easy. I made a big set with curved arms to fit the ends of the elliptical column which is shown on my home page of my website
http://www.treetales.com/
I have even gone a bit farther by making a double arm arrangement which allowed me to make the door, not just pivot, but rather swing out and up to get out of the way for this desk.
Here is a link to an article for that. http://www.woodcentral.com/shots/shot728.shtml
Lots of woodworking tools can do double duty, like the TS, BS, and all sanders and grinders etc.
Incredible work, Keith. I'm pretty fond of Art Nouveau and your desk on WoodCentral is one of the few things I've seen posted around here that's caused me to go back for a second and even third look. It's good to see great work being done out there, especially when it comes from Arkansas.
Thanks, I have not thought of it as having ####Art Nouveau feel, but now that you mentioned it, I can see where you would percieve that. It actually evolved out of series of tables that seem more Japanese. That piece, along with about 24 other works will be going to a new gallery which is opening next weekend. There is an ad in the current issue of At Home in Arkansas on page 40, and a nice write up on page 50. I have been thinking of doing something that will be very Nouveau. I have been seeing only pieces of the design, which is OK, because I don't have time for a project now. Maybe by the time I can get to it, the rest will come to me. I hope I get a chance to do a nice piece in that style, it would be a good match, since I am such a nature freak. Some of my photos are influencing and working into my recent turnings, and the turnings are an easy way to try things to work into the larger pieces. I am desperately in need of a patron to set me free on a few projects like that. You are up there in the land of plenty, why don't you send me one.
Luckily, my mother is a very skilled metalsmith. I still have yet to actually make my own hardware, but I am not at all afraid of using metal in my work.
The thing you have to be prepared for is that metalworking is slow.
You will need some new basic tools in your collection, and unless you are making something very unique, your money is better spent buying the hardware.
Tools to consider:
acetalene torch
flexible shaft drill
jeweler's saw and assortment of blades (2/0 is a good general pitch)
ball peen hammer
anvil
bending steak
nice small swiss detail files
steel block for flattening
raw-hide hammer for flattening w/o marking
....
these are just some basic starter items. The torch is only needed if you plan to solder.
rio grande is a good supplier... their yearly catalog is HUGE.
hope this helps...
vincent
I would love to do some metalwork as well -- a few years ago I took a basic welding class at a tech school... The problem is that the very last thing that I need is another obsession :-) Then I might have to give up sleeping all together...
Cheers,
Michael
All the time. I make all hinges for the patchboxes on my kentucky rifles. Once you learn how to bend brass around a little mandrel(nail) you have the beginning of a hinge.
In my case, I build some 18th century stuff for customers wanting some exact stuff. To their surprise many don't like to hear you tell them the locks were made from steel and not brass. Making a lock with an example in hand is not too tough. I have made just about all of the cupboard locks made be Ball and Ball. Heating and annealing brass is easy once you get a feel for the colors you want as you heat it. I use propane and map gas for the bulk of my brass work. Don't fire up me A-torch that much.
Another skill woodworkers can use is silver soldering. The new stuff(tin/silver) is super strong. You can make small tools all day with this method. Lots of stuff on the internet.
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Edited 11/15/2009 7:13 am ET by danmart
I find it usefull to make small metal parts provided it doesn't take more than a saw, drill, metal bender and files. I'm afraid to start on a lathe - I don't know where I'd find time.
I also made some custom brackets (rough) for use in a barn
One problem. Using the drill press for both wood and metal runs the risk of getting either metal bits or cutting oil in my wood projects. I try my best to clean up, but it's surprizing where things hide!
I suspect that most woodworkers have made their own metalware from time to time. Two examples from my amateur shop: brass reinforcing brackets that were not available at the home center and steel brackets to allow me to hang shopmade cornices over existing window drapes. Metal work does require a different tool set, however.
forrestb
I have to disagree on metal working requiring a different tool set. You can pretty much work non-ferrous with basic woodworking tools. I have done quite a lot of metalmith work professionally.
Steel would require a different set of tools. Most folks tend to lump metal working into what they are framiliar with. There's really many distinct categories and while some overlap they are quite different in tools and working qualities.
1. Casting, bronze is pretty basic and can be done in a backyard foundry. Again it breaks down to different ways of doing the patterns or molds. Sand casting with patterns is the method for production. Sculptors tend to use the lost wax method and the ceramic shell is favored over the plaster mold. Too complex to go into detail here. Centrifugal casting for jewelry and smaller hardware is another method commonly used.
2. Fabricated metal work. I've this using sheet metal along with extruded angles, channels, round and other shapes are available. Again, brass can be worked with most woodworking tools. A metal lathe and milling machine would be necessary for doing more complex stuff. Oxy/acetylene torch is a plus for silver brazing which allows one to build up forms and actually fabricate stuff that would normally be cast. Brass is a good choice as it looks fine in it's normal state but can have a patine finish or be plated or polished. Aluminum is another option which can be worked with most wood tools but finishing is a whole different process. Steel would require different tools but would be less desirable for fine furniture.
3. Forged, Steel with a totally different set of tools but more of a rougher look for the appropriate furniture.
Hey Rick, you said: "Steel would require different tools but would be less desirable for fine furniture."True about needing some other tools, but basic stuff like a good hacksaw and an assortment of good files will go a long way. But what's this nonsense about steel being less desirable for fine furniture? Steel is my first choice of metal. Brass is easier to work, but it's simply the wrong color. It lacks soul. Steel, now, has character and it develops more as it ages. Although some may disparage it as rust, I prefer to call it a natural patina. Hey, we all acquire some.This piece is mahogany and steel. The door handle and the shelves are steel. The outboard sides are wood and steel laminated and cut together.
Rickl, I didn't mean to imply that a completely separate tool set was required, just that using the same tool for metal and then wood could introduce cutting fluids onto your wood that could make finishing difficult. Yes, a split-point drill will work in metal or wood, but consider the cutting fluid left on the bit. I think it would be to your advantage to leave the standard bits to metal and have a separate set of brad-point and/or Forstner bits for wood. I do use my drill press for both materials, but I use the metal stand for metals and have a separate wood platform for wood. Again, just to keep the oils from the wood. Cold chisels versus wood chisels? Files vs rasps? Hacksaws vs miter saws? Opencoat sandpaper vs wet-or-dry? Don't even think about doing metal work on a wood lathe from a safety standpoint. Using a metal lathe for wood might work but, again, the oils on the lathe would surely spoil any finish outside of paint. Your point about brass with woodworking tools is probably okay but even with it I still would use a cutting fluid. Different perspectives are valuable for those getting started.
forrestb
I've cut miles of brass and other nonferrous metal on my table saw, router, etc. Cutting oil isn't necessary in the slightest. I've got a number of years as a professional metalsmith under my belt.
Edited 10/27/2007 5:49 pm ET by RickL
The deco lamp base is polished brass with a polished bright nickel finish. Brass needs no lubrication in cutting whatsoever. Certain harder aluminum alloys benefit with some lube but most non-ferrous is pretty easy to work with standard woodworking toools. Obviously metal sandaper is preferred. Wet sanding keeps the paper lasting longer. Going to a metal forum would be recommended to learn more on metal fabrication but those that know both trades would be more open in procedures and techniques.
Several years ago I was commissioned to build a drafting table for a client, the specs were that it must be in a craftsman style and that all hardware was to be bronze. I'd never done any metal work but always being up for a challenge said sure I could. The hardware needed was quite basic just a couple hinges and a pair of adjustable supports to allow the top to move up and down.
Since then I have made the majority of hardware for both gallery furniture and for commissions. I've got to admit I love wortking with brass and have kept the guys at http://www.onlinemetals.com busy the last copule years! They aren't much for answering questions but you can get brass, bronze, stainless aluminum you name it and in small quantities.
The latest commission was for three sets of identical chess sets all in wenge brass and red heart and maple brass and purple heart. All machining was done with a band saw, disk sander and an assortment of files. Brass works almost as easily as some of the harder hardwoods and looks great polished or brushed.
Give it a try it will add a whole new dimension to your pieces and a whole new skill set as well! I'm really thinking a small metal lathe would be a great addition to my shop!
Madison2
online metals is a good place to get the stuff to the door w/o leaving the shop. ditto
I will use metal when I think it appropriate.
I do not have a picture but once I made some back plates for drawer knobs hammering together US cents. Some copper in there I would assume and they do not rust! Dirty maybe... Amazing what metal will do if you hammer on it ALOT!
Chris,
I like to make campaign style furniture- so there will be brass. I make some fittings, such as angle straps and knobs. Some fittings especially those that are cast such as side carrying handles require further finishing.
For plane making there is some metal work that goes with the knobs and totes.
Dovetails go with all: some would say there may be an obsession there...
Thanks for the photos.. Beautiful work. I like the military chair the best.
Philip:
Are the planes your design or are they from parts supplied by a plane maker? Either way they are gorgeous! Making a metal plane has been on my list for a number of years but I've just never gotten around to it. Maybe if this winter is slow enough I can squeeze that in. Any tips?
Madison2
Madi,
I do make the odd plane now and again- you can see some more on this web site: http://www.marcouplanes.com.The planes are my designs.
Now is the time to start on your metal plane, and there are other folk on this forum such as Ron Brese who make planes, so let us know when you get the urge - could we talking to the first Lady Knots Planemaker?Philip Marcou
Philip:
In a word...WOW! Took a trip to your web site this morning and wandered through. You are correct wood brass and steel are a seductive combination. I am definitely going to have to give planemaking a try. I think the metal lathe just moved up a notch on the gotta have list. Any thoughts on the small combination Mill/Lathe units being advertised?
Thanks for sharing your work. I'll keep in touch as things develop.
Madison2
Madi,
"I think the metal lathe just moved up a notch on the gotta have list. Any thoughts on the small combination Mill/Lathe units being advertised?
There are two formats for those lathe/mill combinations: either the mill is mounted on the head stock of the lathe or it is mounted somewhere around the middle of the bed.
I have only seen the former type but have the second type in the form of the Emco Super Eleven. Forget about the first one-small, restrictive , not good quality.
In fact I would recommend neither. The main criticism of the bed mounted version is that the mill is just not rigid enough , due to it being mounted in the middle of the bed: it is trying to twist the bed all the time. Rigidity is essential for these things.Also, even though one can swing the the mill head out of the way when turning, this is a nuisance .
Much better to have separate units.
These days one gets a lot of lathe for the money and I reckon any busy shop would soon recover the money spent on a smallish lathe (i.e the biggest you can afford (;)) It should at least have a gearbox and power cross feed, and better to have the cabinet model : swarf disposable is easier.
Tips: speak nicely to bank manager and make sure you have the means to see small things properly: most old machinists have glasses with lenses like coke bottle bottoms....Philip Marcou
Philip:
Thanks for the thoughts on the lathe. Fortunately I won't need to smooze a banker so I think the hunt is on! The Jr college near us teaches some classes on metal work think I'll snoop around and see if they'll let an old girl play with the machinery. I'll keep you posted. Again your planes are really beautiful and I think it'd be fair to say you've set the bar quite high. I love a challenge!
Best
Madison
Madi, "I'll snoop around and see if they'll let an old girl play with the machinery."
Just tell them you love SouthBend lathes and you will be in there like a long dog....
Excellent- having access to some classes will save a lot of frustration.Philip Marcou
Philip,
Did you build those two planes yourself from scratch? They sure are beauties!Chris @ flairwoodworks
Chris- what is up with the web site? I tried to go there but a message appears to say "You are banned from this site"....
Yes, I did build those two from scratch.Philip Marcou
Philip,
Are you referring to my website http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com? I checked the spelling and it's okay. If it still doesn't work, I'm out of ideas.Chris @ flairwoodworks
Chris, had a tin knockers class in a high school and as a young man worked for a Master Coopersmith in the Beth steel shipyards. I actually moved from helper to handyman to 3rd class mechanic before I realized that it was warmer in college than in a dry dock on the Hudson River in February.
These days I do small fittings, ferrels, rings, brackets or hinges as required, in addition to sheet work for things like dust collection. Comes in real handy. Paddy
I am very lucky here because anything I generaly need as far as metal work to finish a project is made by my son who is a journyman sheet metal worker. The latest project we made was a rather large birdfeeder with2 -4" plastic cylinders that hold the feed ( makinng it hard for the squrls to take the feed ) with a hip roof that my son applys copper to.
marty
Hey Chris great post! I have been very interested in metalwork but have just scratched the surface. Got my first taste at the Crucible in Oakland CA, amazing fire arts/woodworking facility. I have many friends that are metalworkers so it's just a matter of time before I hit them up for use of there tools and demos on how to.
I have not made any of my own hardware yet but I will. It's definitely what I want for
my furniture to be completely of my own creation.
Salvaged
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