In an excellent video, Chris of Foureyes furniture youtube fame discusses copying another’s work.
In his case, it was a blatant rip off of one of his designs.
Improving On a Stolen Design (youtube.com)
His ultimate perspective was that it was absolutely fine to copy and sell a design provided that it was not in any way stopping the originator of the design from doing their thing.
The takeout I got from this was that:
– It’s fine to rip a design off, but not to compete for selling that design.
– It’s not ok to claim the design as your own.
– Attribution to the originator would be expected.
Although I felt that his approach was very wise, it is very much at odds with the general and more widely held perspectives, especially as repeatedly expressed on such as Shop Talk Live, WoodTalk and pretty much any other place where woodworkers get together to shoot the whatever.
My personal perspective aligns with Chris – but like him, I don’t make a living making things to a specific design.
Would his perspective change how you think?
Replies
Har har har - I would like to write an essay now concerning the highly damaging modern notions of property and ownership upon not just human societies but the planet and everything on and in it.
Sadly, no one here would wish to read my fine essay, as we are all thoroughly programed to accept without question that the current zero-sum game of capitalist economics and its vast array of highly damaging socio-cultural monopolistic substructures are "the only way" or even "a natural law". :-)
Lataxe, probably just a pink-livered evil commie socialist softlad who should be reprogramed in a camp somewhere in the less visited parts of Idaho.
Everyone copies to some extent, whether consciously or unconsciously.
That being said;
The originator of the design should always get their credit and if possible permission. You should never, under any circumstances, pass off anyone else's design as you own. If you're making a copy, indicate that this is a copy of XXXX
IMO, Anyone who disagrees with this has not designed anything on their own, let alone had it copied by someone else.
I’ve been copying Thomas Chippendale, James Krenov and Frank Lloyd Wright all my life never telling anyone and got all the credit !
The Greene brothers have been rolling in their graves for quite sometime now on my account.
There is not a one size fits all answer to this concern. Many large businesses have made a small twist on a competitor’s idea and sold a competitive product without violating patents or any legal concerns.
I have made items similar to others work but have never taken credit for someone else’s creativeness. Failure to acknowledge using someone else’s ideas, suggestions, comments... is questionable integrity for individuals and large businesses.
Its certainly just good manners to mention if someone's particular piece gave you inspiration for yours. But where do we stop?
Every piece of human creation is very far from "original" in the sense that most of its detail, design, materials and several other parameters fully describing it have been evolved over countless generations via probably hundreds if not thousands of contributors through the history of its evolution. Should we ferret out and name all of them every time we make something?
Even those who produce a creation that tends towards the original have in fact incorporated a vast amount of human design and manufacturing history into their creation, not to mention a vast array of other humans who produced the conditions (of their mind, body and socio-cultural support) allowing and enabling them to so-create.
*********
One fundamental aspect of humans is our ability and habit to copy. Without that fundamental ability to copy, we'd still be another ape in the wild, even if a clever one. Nothing of modern human societies and their outputs would exist without out ability and habit of copying.
From one point of view, those who attempt to prevent copying by means of constructs such as monopolies, patents and copyright are a drag-anchor on what's generally called progress. On the other hand, progress is turning out to be something of a curate's egg: tasty for a while but then we all die from those toxins in it. :-)
But I digress.
Lataxe, made of 100% copied stuff.
PS Consider, by the way, a woodworking website. A construct made by copying full of content for others to copy, most of which can be copied free of charge. Huzzah!
This is all so hypothetical. I did pay for the exact plan for the Maloof rocking chair I made for our home. I researched some Stickley tabouret tables and made several from photos, sold them at a charity auction. Ny neighbor bought some ambrosia maple, wanted a printer stand. I looked at the Thos Moser catalog and made one kind of like one in his catalogue. His were either walnut or cherry, mine was maple. I decided to use ball bearing glides since this would be used in a commercial environment, his did not. They bought the wood, I made it for free. If I was making 1000's and selling them on line, big difference. One or two and sold for $50-$100 or free, who cares.
Every time you make a dovetail, you are apparently copying someone on the steppes of (now) Russia who made a wooden doorway to a mammoth bone hut 10,000 years ago, apparently. That said, I think copying something innovative or original deserves credit if you're a volume maker or making a living off of your work. As in "this bureau is a variation on Shaker work" or "starting with a Krenov-style table, I...." or even "this classic arts and crafts design is executed in ash, giving it a lightness and color that will make it stand out from the crowd."
Almost all my builds are my designs. Well as much as possible. I very much doubt that we can completely ignore the design influences of others. At best we give it our own twist. And hopefully there is enough that is different to call it original.
Occasionally I copy the design of someone, and do this deliberately. In such case it is a homage, and I give the designer full credit, often repeatedly, and link to their original. Part of the build is a challenge to create as close a replica as possible. You know, this is not easy, especially when you compare yours with theirs!
Below is my build of Hans Wegner's "Round Chair", often referred to as "The Chair". Mine has the seat in Danish Cord.
https://i.postimg.cc/vBptQzdn/The-Chair.jpg
I am presently building two "DC 09" chairs by Kyoko Inoda and Nils Sveje, designed in 2011. This chair is built by the Miyazaki factory in Japan. Two photos below. The first is the original, and the second is where I am up to at this time.
https://i.postimg.cc/Z5J4qVdR/Chair2.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/rs6GRkP2/T10a.jpg
Lastly, it needs to be clear whether one is building as an amateur, as I am, or a professional. I do not believe that a pro should copy the work of others to sell. I have been asked innumerable times for the plans I made to build these chairs, and I refuse to do so. It is not mine to distribute.
Regards from Perth
Derek